Madmax
12-03-2002, 06:20 PM
This is a topic for any body with insider or otherwise info.
I recently had the pleasure of chatting with the owner of 2 yes 2 T72 MBT's
We discussed the relative capabilities of various soviet v NATO mbt's
The owner had talked in depth with an East German tank company comander and broached the subject of NATO tank superiority eg M1A2 , Challengers etc.
The Soviet sorry East German commander was in full agreement with and fully aware of NATO superiority in MBT's and went on to explain in some detail the soviet methodogy in dealing with NATO MBT's.
I will now atempt to remember all i was told!
1 / The Soviets are fully aware of the flamability ( of their T72's etc)due to the ammo positioning directly under the crew via a circular rotational bin served by the auto loader.(their crews are made aware that the auto loader will feed the careless crew man into the breach via his leg should he get in the way!)
2 / The cramped conditions within their MBT's were frustrating but necessary due to the design constraints put upon them by Soviet military requirements for a cheap rugged and easily maintained vehicle,s that can be produced in substantial numbers cheaply and last but not least tanks that are easy to train large amounts of soldiers on.
3 / The East German commander was quite confident in his tanks ability to handle NATO armour in the European combat enviroment with its relatively close ranges of no more than 1200 metres due to hills/foret not forgetting towns , villages etc all of these causing line of site problems.
4 / The attidude towards combat losses was typicaly Soviet in that he or if you like they expect losses of somewhere in the region of 30 % over and above that of NATO !
He quoted that a T72 or T80 write off kills 3 crewmen while the loss of say a challenger kills 5.However he did apparently smile and concede the superior survivability of NATO MBT's. in relation to the crew and he did envy the comparitive comfort and space saying that Soviet tankers would hold a party inside an M1A2.
5 / The Commander said that with regards to the recent War with IRAQ that he considered that they handled their T72's badly in that they tried fighting a static battle which played into the hands of the allies and enfisised the strengths of the M1's , and Challengers not forgetting the Apache Helo's that give or did give the soviets some concern in any potential European conflict.
6 / The Commander did say that at 500 metres the T72
/ T80 can pierce any western tank and that they would of aimed to close to this range using agressive tactics etc and that casualties would have been accepted in order to ensure a tactical victory.
7 / They are able to start a T72 first time after a 6 month mothball (16 seconds for a start up!)
I may of forgotten something or misquoted so please forgive me.
I would be interested in any coments on any known Kill ratio's percentages etc as i am an avid war gamer / Tank sim nut!
I recently had the pleasure of chatting with the owner of 2 yes 2 T72 MBT's
We discussed the relative capabilities of various soviet v NATO mbt's
The owner had talked in depth with an East German tank company comander and broached the subject of NATO tank superiority eg M1A2 , Challengers etc.
The Soviet sorry East German commander was in full agreement with and fully aware of NATO superiority in MBT's and went on to explain in some detail the soviet methodogy in dealing with NATO MBT's.
I will now atempt to remember all i was told!
1 / The Soviets are fully aware of the flamability ( of their T72's etc)due to the ammo positioning directly under the crew via a circular rotational bin served by the auto loader.(their crews are made aware that the auto loader will feed the careless crew man into the breach via his leg should he get in the way!)
2 / The cramped conditions within their MBT's were frustrating but necessary due to the design constraints put upon them by Soviet military requirements for a cheap rugged and easily maintained vehicle,s that can be produced in substantial numbers cheaply and last but not least tanks that are easy to train large amounts of soldiers on.
3 / The East German commander was quite confident in his tanks ability to handle NATO armour in the European combat enviroment with its relatively close ranges of no more than 1200 metres due to hills/foret not forgetting towns , villages etc all of these causing line of site problems.
4 / The attidude towards combat losses was typicaly Soviet in that he or if you like they expect losses of somewhere in the region of 30 % over and above that of NATO !
He quoted that a T72 or T80 write off kills 3 crewmen while the loss of say a challenger kills 5.However he did apparently smile and concede the superior survivability of NATO MBT's. in relation to the crew and he did envy the comparitive comfort and space saying that Soviet tankers would hold a party inside an M1A2.
5 / The Commander said that with regards to the recent War with IRAQ that he considered that they handled their T72's badly in that they tried fighting a static battle which played into the hands of the allies and enfisised the strengths of the M1's , and Challengers not forgetting the Apache Helo's that give or did give the soviets some concern in any potential European conflict.
6 / The Commander did say that at 500 metres the T72
/ T80 can pierce any western tank and that they would of aimed to close to this range using agressive tactics etc and that casualties would have been accepted in order to ensure a tactical victory.
7 / They are able to start a T72 first time after a 6 month mothball (16 seconds for a start up!)
I may of forgotten something or misquoted so please forgive me.
I would be interested in any coments on any known Kill ratio's percentages etc as i am an avid war gamer / Tank sim nut!