SB Noob questions

[Torak101]

Hi all,
I have a few questions about the old version of SB.
I'm a vet PC gamer (and an actual vet :D ) I have a few friends and we where all talking about playing something new online.

We where thinking of going BF2 (Battlefield 2) but someone suggested a tank sim. This game is basically the only one out there. The BF series is basically a shooter and is pretty good in its arena but the realism in out the window.

So we are in the process of getting some old copies off of Ebay. Now, let me explain that...not everyone wants to put 125 bucks into a game that we might not like. (we are all mostly vets of one sort or another)

*Is SB comparable to SB pro aside from the graphics? Is the A.I. the same?
*What are the basic differences between SB and SB pro to justify 10 bucks on Ebay or 125 here?
*How is the A.I.? being an older game, personally I'm a bit worried about that.
*can you play the original SB online?
*can you play SB online with people who have SB pro?

Basically we are wondering if SB and SB pro are the same game only one has better graphics.
The information here on this site isn't really clear as it is all SB pro focused.
Also, there is an SB2 on the way? If so, about when is do out?

Thanks for they help!

[Sean]

1) No. Not even close in the graphics department. SB1 is software accelerated. Pro PE is a new graphics engine that is hardware accelerated. Look through the screenshots section some, you will easily pick out the difference. That said, you quickly forget how old the graphics are once you get into it. The AI is about the same, but a little bit deadlier in pro pe.

2) Id go ahead and get SB1 first, then decide if you like the game play. If you like it then you can think about ProPE.

3) They will kill you.

4) Yes.

5) No.

They are not the same. I'd suggest getting SB1, playing it, then read through the esim site to see some of the things that are added in pro pe. Check out some of the screenshots posted in the forums. Pro PE is a little more complicated than SB1 to learn and play. Theres more responsibilities to juggle as a player - ammo management, crossing bridges, breeching minefields, helicopters, several new playable vehicles to learn, etc. It also has steeper system requirements due to the graphics engine.

SB2 will not be available anytime soon. Check back in a year or two maybe.

[12Alfa]

Also check out the vids to see waht the sim is like...

[3Star]

Is SB comparable to SB pro aside from the graphics? Is the A.I. the same?

Sortof. SBP has a lot more features in terms of capability (such as engineering works) and in vehicles. A lot of the underlying philosophy is pretty similar. The $10 might give you a taste of SBP, but it's only an appetizer, not a main course. If you don't mind the old graphics, and are not really a purist, SB1 will probably give you some enjoyment. Consider SBP to be the Falcon 4.0 of the Tank Sim World. Even the apparently small issue of distinguishing between 40 rounds available to a tank in SB1 and the 40 rounds split between ready and semi-ready in SBP has a massive effect on gameplay and realism.

*What are the basic differences between SB and SB pro to justify 10 bucks on Ebay or 125 here?

The difference is more in the details than in any great whopping features. Obviously the graphics are the most immediate ones. Followed closely by the amount of vehicles in the game: With the various militaries using the software, they've paid for the additions of new toys for us, the users, including of note M2 and Leopard 1. The damage model is, I believe, improved. Logistics is better represented. Artillery is harder to use. Infantry should be becoming more realistic with a Swedish-funded upgrade, if memory serves. With the less all-seeing thermal imager, more realistic platoon movement is encouraged, as is more thorough scanning.

*How is the A.I.? being an older game, personally I'm a bit worried about that.

AI is pretty similar. Bear in mind, there is zero strategic AI. The AI will not come up with battle plans and react to your movements, that is controlled solely by the scenario designer. AI is limited to tank operation: How the tank crew reacts to stimuli, how the driver goes hull-down etc, that sort of thing. A good scenario designer can make the OpFor seem like it's under human control.

*can you play the original SB online?

Yes. It was my preferred method of play (and of any game I owned) for some five years.

*can you play SB online with people who have SB pro?

Only if they have SB1 and are willing to go back to it for a game. Few will be, once you've converted, it's kindof hard to fire SB1 again and go back.

Spend the $10. If you don't like SB1, you probably won't like SBP. (Graphics notwithstanding). If you do like SB1, you'll probably love SBP. Yes, it will tally $135 to do the lot, but what the hell.. There are more expensive toys out there.

NTM

[Torak101]

Thanks for the replies guys.

I got a hold of an old demo yesterday and have been tinkering around with it.

Its completely different from my usual playstyle so its gonna take some time getting use to. Aside from the graphics and few really annoying interface features its very challenging so far.

(one example, you need to hit f5 to get into the map view but you need to mouse click on a button to get out? it would be nice if you could f5 again to return to your originating view. Simple little things like that but annoying :D )

Is the interface a bit more smooth in the SB pro?

The A.I seems pretty competant so I am no longer worried about that. Your own tank crews seem a bit on the sluggish side. When moving an entire platoon they seem to loose the initive and get fired on first alot. I think I'm playing it to fast though. I'm moving to far to fast.

All in all, pretty good game so far..... I should get the full version this week some time. Its a nice break from all the spastic Shooters and MMO's out there.

[Trekker]

To leave F5/Map view, just click on F1,F6,F7,F8, to end up in the position you want.

Moving makes you loose some observation, just as in real life. So thats normal. Also a tank moving is alot easier to detect then one standing in battleposition, only revealing it's turret.

The interface is the same, but there is more options in every function. More you can and have to do with the tank.

[Torak101]

Well after playing around with this game today I gotta say this....

Getting assigned to my company is pretty much a death sentence.

[Awac835]

Well after playing around with this game today I gotta say this....

Getting assigned to my company is pretty much a death sentence.

he he, same with me, but im learning. Have to get better at accepting i just cant roll in but sometimes have to back off and call in artilary on enemy dug in posistions.

[Lone*star49]

...

Congrats to ya both, as most that got the ongoing, rude-awakening (truth) of SB (the "sim") have not been able to fall back and regroup as you have, because they couldn't push "the easy button" and become invincible, nor ever run out of ammo, and just keep firing away..


LS

[Torak101]

Hey Lone*star49, Im an ex-tank crewman so everything in the game is very familar. TRP's, BP's, the map grids.... all that stuff. Its just learning the management of the game.

I need to learn how to manage the battles more effectively.
For example:

1)cross attaching platoons when they take casualties so I don't have to hop around to singular vehicles. Can that be done? A section of Bradlies attached to a section of tanks for example.

2)Is there a way to pre-set BP's along an attack route? It is sort of bad when when my tanks arrive at the CP and just stop lol. Sure they engage but they are usually sitting in the open.

3)The vast majority of my casualties are the result of arty fire. Is there a way to get your vehicles to react to an arty barrage rather then just sitting there until you come along and manually move them?

[Lone*star49]

...

~ SPACE FOR RENT ~

[Lone*star49]

Hey Lone*star49, Im an ex-tank crewman so everything in the game is very familar. TRP's, BP's, the map grids.... all that stuff. Its just learning the management of the game.

I need to learn how to manage the battles more effectively.
For example:

1)cross attaching platoons when they take casualties so I don't have to hop around to singular vehicles. Can that be done? A section of Bradlies attached to a section of tanks for example.

2)Is there a way to pre-set BP's along an attack route? It is sort of bad when when my tanks arrive at the CP and just stop lol. Sure they engage but they are usually sitting in the open.

3)The vast majority of my casualties are the result of arty fire. Is there a way to get your vehicles to react to an arty barrage rather then just sitting there until you come along and manually move them?
...

1. yes, only after game begins, or, with multiple Company sce's, you'll have that from the start.

2. yes, you can pre-route any unit/s to set *BP's along with further BP's that once they get to first assingned BP, when your rdy, you can clk on any set unit, and hit "proceed", and they head off to the next set *BP.

3. actually, not most of the times, as with a set BP with a "defend" order, or guard, etc. The AI units that have been set with defend or guard orders will move somewhere around 200m from any set BP to avoid artty on them, or when artty is heard coming in, will start to move fast, as opposed to having "no orders, or IIRC, "a hold order", once they get to a waypoint/set position, and yep, when the artty starts in, they die in place.

All these questions will be addressed in both the manual and most tuitorials you will recieve with either SB1, or SB Pro Pe.


Enjoy..



LS

[RENEGADE-623]

LS, in reference to your first answer, you are wrong, what he was saying is grouping vehicles together like a bradley and tank together and stuff like that. Yoiu cant do that. In order to do that, the vehicles must be same and from same platoon originally

[Joe]

Lead them to the same route and they behave the same. I don't know if it's useful since they get stuck together in a very close space (arty etc) and they won't work together as a "team" (hunter killer etc), so the answer is nes or yo (in German we'd say Jein- as a phonetic corruption of ja= yes and nein= no: jein) anyway. But that's the challenge in SB (1 or ProPE): to set your forces in a way that they will win (or lose). In general: if you can afford it (without being hungry for half a year ;) ) get Pro PE. It has totally different = better grafics, it has more features to set up enemy/friendly AI routines via editor (e.g. see above engineering) and if you like to "play" online you'll find more ppl "playing" ProPE but SB1. Do not take the manual for the fountain of wisdom. The abilties of the editor would fill a book of >600 pages I guess ;) and it takes 4+ years to learn how to use it properly :D

[Ssnake]

1)cross attaching platoons when they take casualties so I don't have to hop around to singular vehicles. Can that be done? A section of Bradlies attached to a section of tanks for example.
No, it can't. We're working on it, but its an issue that incluences many, many parts of the code, so we can't change that on the fly.
2)Is there a way to pre-set BP's along an attack route? It is sort of bad when when my tanks arrive at the CP and just stop lol. Sure they engage but they are usually sitting in the open.
If you're talking about emplacements - well, you can open the mission editor and place them along the route. The question is, who'd be digging them in real life? Yeah, right: Combat engineers. :lol:

I can but recommend the LOS tool to identify minor variations in the terrain that offer you a bit of cover and concealment. You may want to let a route end short in front of the small hill, and let the vehicles creep forward into a hull-down position automatically. They can do that. They'll start looking in front of their position, up to 400m, then go back up to 200m behind their original point of arrival. Therefore it's best to place the waypoint about 200m short of the intended position.
3)The vast majority of my casualties are the result of arty fire. Is there a way to get your vehicles to react to an arty barrage rather then just sitting there until you come along and manually move them?
Yes. For every single BP you should create a an alternative BP, and connect both with two retreat routes - one without an embark condition, and one with an explicit embark condition like unit (this) is under (indirect) fire. If you use only that route the unit could not use the route if it came under direct fire. Also, you may want to adopt a routine of not staying longer than 1:15 in a position. Since the minimum reaction time of enemy artillery is 1:30, this gives you 15 seconds to depart before the earliest moment that the shells impact on your position.

[Torak101]

If you're talking about emplacements - well, you can open the mission editor and place them along the route. The question is, who'd be digging them in real life? Yeah, right: Combat engineers.

I can but recommend the LOS tool to identify minor variations in the terrain that offer you a bit of cover and concealment. You may want to let a route end short in front of the small hill, and let the vehicles creep forward into a hull-down position automatically. They can do that. They'll start looking in front of their position, up to 400m, then go back up to 200m behind their original point of arrival. Therefore it's best to place the waypoint about 200m short of the intended position.

Correct, I wasn't referring to prepared positions just a way to get your vehicles to seek some cover behind the terrain in the area.

Thanks