Kaytusha Rocket

[Ratel]

Could somebody please point me in the right direction for more info on the above mentioned?

When I search for it in google I get cocktail recipes and Pal/Israel news events and FAS.org doesn't list it :roll:

[Storm91]

Better check the spelling on that i found it last Year when they fired 2 of em over my sisters carrier in jordan.The nice thing about soviet cold war era equipment is it never changes.

[9erRed]

Greetings Ratel,

Ref. the Rocket Artillery (BM-21)

Look here for some info on the upgrade of the aging BM-21 systems to more modern systems.

http://images.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://www.airforce-technology.com/contractor_images/ankol/4s_bm-21.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.airforce-technology.com/contractors/logistics/ankol/&h=199&w=150&sz=6&hl=en&start=7&tbnid=NT-I08smh4TyTM:&tbnh=104&tbnw=78&prev=/images%3Fq%3DBM-21%26svnum%3D10%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26sa%3DG

Sorry for the large URL.

Also look at these for more info.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/9K51_Grad

http://trans.voila.fr/ano?anourl=http%3A//armyreco.ifrance.com/russe/vehicule_artillerie/bm-21/bm-21_russie_identification.htm&anolg=65544

And finally the whole google find list of images.

http://images.google.ca/images?q=BM-21&btnG=Search&svnum=10&hl=en&lr=

Hope that helps, and if your having difficulty finding something then narrow the search to just images, from which you can expand your search.

Later ..... 9erRed

[MatsW]

Katjuscha/Katyusha was a Soviet rocket artilleri system during the WW2. It was also called Stalin Organ. It's also the name for more simple "home-made" single pipe rocket launcher that is, for example, used to send rockets into Israel.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katyusha

[Ssnake]

It's also the name for more simple "home-made" single pipe rocket launcher that is, for example, used to send rockets into Israel.Also known as "Kassam", right?

[Ghost]

Ssnake any chance of seeing this piece in Steelbeasts :D :D :D :wink:

[nimo]

Also known as "Kassam", right?

no, kassam is a home made missile, while Katusha is a military made rocket - that Hezbollah use a home made single pipe launch platform (it's easy to hide)

[mapman]

This is a response to them...

http://www.foxnews.com/photoessay/photoessay_1053_images/0713061425_M_071307_gaza5.jpg

[Scorpius]

Boom boom artillery!

[Ssnake]

... kassam is a home made missile, while Katusha is a military made rocket
What are the operational characteristics of the Kassam - if you are at liberty to discuss that. What's the approximate "caliber equivalent", range, and accuracy of it?

[stuart666]

Also known as "Kassam", right?

no, kassam is a home made missile, while Katusha is a military made rocket - that Hezbollah use a home made single pipe launch platform (it's easy to hide)

Sounds remarkably like the weapon the Afghans were fond of using against the Soviets, though In that case I gather the weapons were Chinese built.

[nimo]

What are the operational characteristics of the Kassam - if you are at liberty to discuss that. What's the approximate "caliber equivalent", range, and accuracy of it?

Here you go (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qassam_rocket) - you will find the table of various Qassam rocket at the bottom.
the accuracy is so bad, half the time they land inside palestinian territory, but when you target a city that's will do.

[TankHunter]

FAS does have it, it is under it's more conventional designation and not it’s nickname.

[desertowl]

as nimo said , while the QASSAM is the common name for improvised rockets launched by the various terrorist groups from gaza strip,
israel is targeted with 107 mm (type 63 chinese or the iranian 'haseb' derivative), 122 mm 'grad' (bm21) or the 'arash' iranian equivilant.
in recent attacks we also seen use of fajer 5/7 rockets (43/75 KM range respectively, iranian made) , the iranian developers treated us
with metal "bearing balls" for AP frag effect.
those were 60 seconds on the terrorist aritillery threat to the israely rear.
if you'd like more details on the rockets beeing used or the latest developments and conflict, i will be happy to answer.
BTW - i'm a little busy right now , as you can imagine, so my plans to get SB were postponed,but i hope to get the sim fairly soon, when time allowes...

[TankHunter]

Hey desertowl, take care there.

[RogueSnake79]

All these years, and that Katusha is still an effective weapons system.

Are they using the truck, or firing them from another "Jerry rigged" system?

[desertowl]

they have them fitted on pick-ups, rigged launchers and also the mil standard 'partizan' launcher designed especialy for low signature launches of 122 mm rockets.
however - as a thumb rule, the bigger the rocket the more dependant it becomes on a steady, mil standard launcher.

[silberwiese]

The contrivancer of the Quasam-rocket, Adnan al Guls , was excecuted by the israelis in October 2004 in Gaza-City. He was the second leader of the military part of the Hamas, called "Issedine al-Kassam". He was the waepon expertof the Hamas.

The Hamas rearm currently with more sophisticated weapons than Kathusha rockets. They have rockets form iran,called Fajr-3 and Fajr-5 witha range of 50 Kilometers an a warhead of 20 kg. On Friday, a cruise missile, hit a israel nvy ship and damaged ist seriously. Expert belive ist a C-802 (NATO-Code: "Saccade"), developed by the Iran an China.

[NEpi]

actually, the Katyusha is not that effective. it is good for disrupting civilian life, but it doesn't pose much threat to the fighting force, and firing on cities doesn't strand military forces too much.
on the other hand, it exposes the users to return fire, which makes them vulnerable.
AFAIK, in both Katyusha and Kassam cases, most of the injured and killed were operating the systems rather people on the recieving side.

[flyboy]

And that is where it is doing the most damage.Having civies wondering when one is going to hit them .Same thing happened with the V1 and V2 menace in england during WW2.They are a terror weapon.

[NEpi]

but weapons of terror were never decisive in the past. still, those who use them now think they can make radical changes with them. since effectiveness is measured by the purpose, I think such rockets are ineffective, and even counter-effective.

[flyboy]

Exactly.The back of British society was never broken,as was any that was attacked by terror.All they are is a nuisance that takes away valuable resources from the armed forces.Having to put pressure on the government to fight back to protect the civilians.Woah going waaay OT there...Ssnake is it something the customers are really concerned about having most actions being guerilla in style.Not the huge open armoured battles of the past.Or do they want to try cover all their bases in terms of best training for the troops.

[Ssnake]

Well, it seems important these days to train for situation with irregular forces disguising as civilians. To that extent we'll need civilians at some point, and then some who look but don't act like civvies. Not exactly a trivial thing to get right.

[NEpi]

also, most guerilla fighting is done on a much smaller scale than the one simulated by SB. it's also closer in range usually (ambushes, urban terrain, etc.).
I'm not sure that matching SB engine to such detail is optimal, since it will demand huge changes in SB engine, and will make SB an extremely heavy-load application (try calculating LoS with damage to buildings inside dense urban terrain for a range of 5km).

I think that SB focusing on the large-scale battle rather than on the guerilla battle is better. if such a guerilla scale is needed, then there should be a different angine to be used.

[Volcano]

Not necissarily. Guerilla warfare scenarios could easily just involve a convoy of vehicles or a single platoon versus an uncertain and random situation.

That would be the optimal goal. Once we reach that point the scenario designer would have the ability to make one single scenario that has a wide range of random possibilities that would cause a different dilemma each time. Throw in IEDs and especially VBIEDs and it will be an excellent critical thinking / reactionary training device on how to deal with a terrorist threat to an escorted convoy or fighting position.

[ShermansWar]

The Qassam rocket (also Qassam missile or Kassam) is a simple homemade steel rocket filled with explosives, produced by the Palestinian Hamas movement. Three models have been used, all of which lack a guidance system or even a directional control gyroscope. They are almost always aimed at civilian villages or installations in Israel. As such they are considered a "terrorist weapon."

The Gaza Strip, from which all but one of the Qassams have been launched, is surrounded by a security barrier and is free of Israeli soldiers. Palestinian militants have therefore had difficulty launching the rockets from outside Gaza. The Qassam is intended to travel over the barrier and strike Israeli targets outside the strip.
Contents
[hide]

* 1 History of the Qassam
o 1.1 Reaction
o 1.2 Casualties in proportion
o 1.3 Navy response
o 1.4 West Bank fears
* 2 Katyusha fears
* 3 List of notable Qassam attacks
* 4 Qassam rocket models
o 4.1 Similar rockets
* 5 References
* 6 External links

[edit]

History of the Qassam

Qassam rockets are named after the Izz ad-Din al-Qassam Brigades, the military branch of Hamas. According to the Hamas, the Qassam rocket was first developed by Nidal Fat'hi Rabah Farahat and produced under the direction of Adnan al-Ghoul, known as the "Father of the Qassam," who was killed by the Israeli army in October 2004.

Qassams were first fired at Israeli targets in October 2001. However, due to their short range, all landed inside the Gaza Strip. The first Qassam to land in Israeli territory was launched on February 10, 2002. The first time an Israeli city was hit was on March 5, 2002, when two rockets struck Sderot. The total number of Qassam rockets launched exceeded 1000 by June 9, 2006. Large numbers of rockets began landing in the Western Negev in March of 2006: 49 in March, 64 in April, 46 in May, and over 83 by the end of June. This prompted protests and a demonstration in the town of Sderot, which has been a major target.

Israeli cities and towns have been the main target of Qassams. In some areas, such as Sderot and some Israeli settlements in Gaza, shelling occurred frequently. They usually land in open areas, but Qassam rockets have killed 6 to 8 Israelis, three foreign workers and some Palestinians to date. The first fatalities caused by a Qassam occurred on September 29, 2004. A rocket fell in the town of Sderot, killing Dorit Benisian, aged 2 and Yuval Abebeh, 4.

In August 2003, a Qassam traveled five miles from the Gaza Strip into Israel and landed near Ashkelon. Another rocket landed near Ashkelon on December 15, 2005, and rockets have hit near the city on several subsequent occasions. On June 29, 2006 a dud rocket landed in a neighborhood of Ashkelon for the first time. Ashkelon is the farthest city from Gaza to have been struck by the rockets. The city provides numerous attractive targets besides its civilian population. Defined as 'national infrastructure' installations, the Rottenberg Power Station and the Eilat-Ashkelon Pipeline have both been hit a few times causing minor damage.

Other Israeli communities in the Negev to have been hit by Qassam rockets include Or HaNer, Nirim, and Nahal Oz.

On December 26, 2005, the military wing of the Al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigades claimed it possessed BM-21 "Grad" rockets with a range of 25 kilometers (about 15 miles), and that it could hit southern Israel communities previously immune to rocket threat. The group claimed, however, that it will not launch the rockets unless the IDF attacks the Gaza Strip or assassinates one of their leaders.
[edit]

Reaction

Despite the Qassam's meager characteristics as a rocket, its use shocked the Israeli army and public, who are used to the Palestinians lacking any method of long-range terrorist weaponry. Hezbollah, in contrast, has long shelled Israel from Lebanon using the Katyusha rocket, hitting cities as well as farms and military targets in the sparsely populated northern border zone.

Most of the launches prior to 2006 were carried out by Hamas from the Gaza Strip town of Beit Hanoun. Following Hamas's victory in Palestinian elections, other groups such as Islamic Jihad and Al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigade have launched Qassama as well.

In order to minimize casualties, the IDF has deployed the Red Dawn early defense system in Sderot and later on in Ashkelon and other smaller civilian concentration at risk. The system consists of an advanced radar that detects rockets as they are being launched. Loudspeakers warn civilians to take cover approximately 20 seconds before impact in an attempt to minimize much of the threat posed by the rockets. In November 2005, the press reported that the Israel Defense Forces would be purchasing Skyshield, a Swiss-designed rapid fire anti-aircraft defense system specifically to counter any future Qassam attacks.[1]

Israel has tried to stop the development and manufacture of such rockets by extensive crackdowns on militants, including assassinations, and by the destruction of facilities (such as metal shops) which are, or could be used for their construction. It has also destroyed the family homes of many Palestinians involved in the construction or firing of rockets.

Qassam launches have also been the catalyst for a number of large-scale Israeli raids on Gaza, such as Operation Days of Penitence in October 2004. Operation Summer Rains, begun June 27 2006, was triggered by the abduction of Cpl. Gilad Shalit from an Israeli outpost, but it also reflected pressure on the Israel government and IDF to stop the Qassams.
The neutrality of this article is disputed.
Please see the discussion on the talk page.
[edit]

Casualties in proportion

One claim reports at least 13 people have been killed as a result of Qassam rocket fire at Israeli targets. Other claims vary. In a June 29th, 2006 Democracy Now interview, Norman Finkelstein discussed the usage of Qassams in contrast to Israeli artillery shelling:

"Since Israel withdrew from Gaza in September 2005 ’til today, the estimates run between 7,000 and 9,000 heavy artillery shells have been shot and fired into Gaza at militant targets. On the Palestinian side, the estimates are approximately 1,000 Kassam missiles, crude missiles, have been fired into Israel" at mostly civilian targets ..."approximately 80 Palestinians have been killed in Gaza due to Israel artillery firing"..."There have been exactly eight Israelis killed in the last five years from the Kassam missiles. [1]

Shimon Peres, a prominent figure in the Israeli Left, claimed that Israel can afford to ignore Qassam fire[2]. Right wing Israelis counter that Israel cannot permit militants to continually impinge its sovereignty and security with impunity.
[edit]

Navy response

On March 29, 2006, IDF vessels shelled rocket launching sites in the Gaza Strip for the first time. The IDF directed artillery shells at areas in Gaza used by rocket launching cells, mostly in the northern part of the Strip, in a bid to deter militant cells from operating there.

In the course of these bombardments, which in some cases lasted hours at a time, dozens of shells were launched. The IDF has said the fire is very accurate and never aimed at populated areas, in order to prevent Palestinian civilian casualties.[2]
[edit]

West Bank fears

A particular concern for the Israelis is the development of longer range Qassam missiles that if fielded by Hamas in the West Bank would be used to strike at the cities in the country's coastal heartland. Numerous attempts have been made to transfer the production of the rockets to the West Bank, but most have failed, as there has only been one rocket attack from that region.

On December 11, 2005, the Al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades and the Palestinian Islamic Jihad claimed to have fired a Qassam rocket from the West Bank at Israeli civilian targets.[3] However, Israeli officials denied such a launch took place, saying the claim was either a lie or the rocket malfunctioned.[4] Three days later, on December 14, an Israeli operation in the West Bank town of Nablus uncovered explosive labs which were producing Qassam rockets.[5] In January 2006, however, Israel reported that a Qassam had indeed been launched from the West Bank.[6]

On April 9, 2006, the elite Duvdevan Battalion killed Tanzim fugitive Jabar Akhras in Bethlehem after he opened fire on them during an arrest operation. Akhras personally killed two Israeli soldiers on November 18, 2003, and Israel said he had been the leading figure in attempting to build Qassams in the West Bank.[7]

On July 9, 2006, a Palestinian militant attempt to fire an improvised rocket in the Tulkarem failed. Several Palestinian sources boasted during the weekend that they "managed" to launch a rocket, but it turned out that the attempt totally failed.[8]

On July 11, 2006, for the second time in past few days Palestinian militants attempted to launch a rocket from northern West Bank into Israel. The Al-Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades and The Al-Quds brigades claimed they succeeded in launching a rocket from the West Bank town of Jenin into Israel. IDF officials have denied any knowledge regarding the rocket launch attempt, saying that if one took place the rocket may not have reached the lift-off stage.[9]
[edit]

Katyusha fears

On March 28, 2006, Islamic Jihad fired a 122mm (4.8") dia Katyusha rocket (2.8 meters (9') long, weighing 66 kilograms (ca 150 lb) and carrying a 17-kilogram (38 lb) warhead; see BM-21), a much longer-range projectile than the Qassam, from the Gaza Strip into Israel.[10] Katyushas have never before been fired from the Palestinian controlled areas. It is believed that it was apparently orchestrated by Hezbollah, since they are known to use these rockets in northern Israel. Islamic Jihad spokesman Abu Abdullah claimed that hundreds of these rockets were smuggled into the Strip by ship across the Gaza-Egypt border from Sinai. Israeli officials downplayed Islamic Jihad's announcement and said the militant group was in possession of only "a small amount" of Katyushas.[11]

It caused no injuries or damage, but the IDF believes that this could be the beginning of a new era of rockets fired at Israel, replacing highly inaccurate Qassam rockets with Katyushas.[12] It also raised fears that Gaza-based militant groups might have obtained additional weaponry, including anti-aircraft missiles.
[edit]

List of notable Qassam attacks

* June 28, 2004, Mordechai Yosepov, 49, and Afik Zahavi, 4, were killed when a Qassam rocket fired by Hamas militants in the Gaza Strip struck near a nursery school in the northern Negev town of Sderot.[13]

* September 29, 2004, On the eve of the Sukkot holiday, Yuval Abebeh, 4, and Dorit Benisian, 2, were killed by a Qassam rocket fired from Gaza into Sderot. About 30 people were wounded in the attack, for which Hamas claimed responsibility.[14]

* December 14, 2004, a female agricultural worker from Thailand was killed by a Qassam rocket in Ganei Tal in the Gush Katif settlement. Two others were wounded. Hamas claimed responsibility.

* January 11, 2005, a rocket killed Nissim Arbiv in Nisanit. Hamas claimed responsibility.

* January 15, 2005, a Qassam rocket attack on Sderot left Ayala (Ella) Abukasis brain dead, as she was hurt while shielding her younger brother. She died on January 21.[15]

* June 7, 2005, Salah Ayash Imran, 57, Muhammed Mahmoud Jaroun, and Bi Shude, 46, were killed, and five other workers were wounded, when a Qassam rocket hit a packing shed in Ganei Tal, in the Gaza Strip. The Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility for the attack.[16]

* July 14, 2005, Dana Galkowicz, 22, was killed in a Qassam attack in the Kibbutz Netiv Ha'asara, just north of the Gaza Strip. Hamas, Islamic Jihad and Fatah all claimed responsibility for the attack.[17]

* September 24, 2005, five Israelis were injured when Palestinian militants launched about 30 rockets on Israeli communities from the Gaza Strip. This attack followed an incident the previous day, in which 20 Palestinians, including 16 civilians, were killed when a vehicle carrying Qassam rockets exploded during a Hamas rally in Jabalya. The exact circumstances surrounding the incident are still unknown. To date, no evidence has been found to substantiate Hamas’ claim that Israeli interference was responsible for the accident.[18]

* December, 2005, a Qassam rocket launched from the West Bank hit near the moshav of Ram-on, near the northern town of Afula.[6]

* December 26, 2005, a Qassam rocket landed at a very small distance from a kindergarten during a Hanukkah party at kibbutz Sa'ad.[19]

* February 3, 2006, a Qassam rocket struck a family's house in the western Negev village of Kibbutz Karmiya, moderately injuring four people, including a 7-month-old baby.[20]

* March 28, 2006, a Qassam rocket lying on the ground exploded, killing two Israeli-Arab shepherds in Kibbutz Nachal Oz. This incident was at first falsely reported as being a loose IDF shell that exploded. Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility.[21]

* March 30, 2006, Two Qassam rockets landed in Kibbutz Karmiya, south of Ashkelon, one of them landed in a soccer field, where children played only hours earlier, and injured one person.

* June 11, 2006, Three people are wounded, one critically when a Qassam landed near the Sapir Academic College near the Negev town of Sderot.[22] 14 Qassams are fired throughout the day.[23]

* July 5, 2006, First Qassam rocket of increased strength is fired into the school yard in the Southern Israeli coastal city of Ashkelon, with a population of 120,000. This has been the first instance of an increased distance Qassam rockets can reach and the first time a significantly large city has been attacked. No one was injured in this attack.[24]

* July 6, 2006, A second Qassam was fired and hit Ashkelon 24 hours after the first. Eight people went into shock, four of them children.[25]

[edit]

Qassam rocket models
Qassam 3 Qassam 2 Qassam 1
Length (cm) 200+ 180 79
Diameter (cm) 17 15 6
Weight (kg) 90 32 5.5
Explosives Payload (kg) 10 5-7 0.5
Maximum Range (km) 10 8-10 3
[edit]

Similar rockets

Other Palestinian armed groups also developed home-made rockets, but they are much less common than Hamas' Qassam rocket. The media frequently refer to all Palestinian high-trajectory rockets as "Qassam rockets" or "Qassam missiles", as it refers to most rockets fired from Lebanon as "Katyushas".

* Hamas - Qassam rocket (models 1, 2 and 3)
* Palestinian Islamic Jihad - Al Quds rocket, Al Quds 101 rocket
* Popular Resistance Committees - al-Nasser rocket (models 1,2,3 and 4)
* Tanzim - Seraya rocket

[ShermansWar]

Kassam 1 rockets

[ShermansWar]

Kassam 2 rockets

[flyboy]

Cool can we have Rolls Royce VBIEDs,always wanted to destroy something like that. :D..Thanks for the pics and info Sherman.Here in Auss we have been pretty lucky in regard to this sort of stuff.Makes you appreciate your life.

[ShotMagnet]

Makes you wonder if 'Kassam' is Arabic for 'Congreve'.


Shot

[RogueSnake79]

Nice informative post Sherman.

[ShermansWar]

Nepi said:
"actually, the Katyusha is not that effective"

Tell that to the Krauts that got pulverized by them at Kursk and Berlin......

What i am really interested in is the statement that an israeli shipm was hit by a cruise missile. do we have any details, sources or confirmation on that? that seems to be a significant event.I wonder when the last time an israeli ship was hit. wouldnt suprise me if it was during the Yom Kippur war.

[ShermansWar]

Makes you wonder if 'Kassam' is Arabic for 'Congreve'.


Shot

Right?lol :lol:

[ShotMagnet]

What i am really interested in is the statement that an israeli shipm was hit by a cruise missile. do we have any details, sources or confirmation on that?To my knowledge it was actually a UAV, carrying explosives.


Shot

[ShermansWar]

Israeli sources now say it was a missile, although it was originally reported to be a drone

[Ssnake]

Tanknet has two threads devoted to that issue.

[desertowl]

indeed - the ssar 5 missile corvette was hit by a c 802 missile at its rear.
it suffered substantial damage and 4 casualties onboard.
it had to return to base for general repairs.
the main reason for the hit was that this threat wasn't expected at the lebanon scene and the ECM and anti missile systems didn't operate at the needed mode, in order to allow israeli aerial activities at the vicinity of the ships.
this anfortunate incident is beeing investigated by the navy and initial operational conclusions already issued.
it is worth noticing that the c 802 was purchased by iran and deliverd to the hizballah, as most of the advanced weapons used by the organization.
syrian weapons systems were also found, some of which procured from russia under EULA by syria but still found their way to hizballah.


c 802:
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/china/c-802.htm
saar 5 class:
http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/saar5/

[NEpi]

sherman, the Katyusha is effective only when used in large numbers over a short time. the ability to do so is a big advantage of rockets over the slower firing howitzers.
by using sporadic rockets (as many as 10) to attack cities is ineffective.

for the attack of the Saar 5 class ship, I already said what I know about it (not much, sorry). although I don't know when was the last time an israeli ship was hit, my guess is maybe '82, but it might be Yom Kipur (a very interesting naval war, btw. first time ECM was used successfully, afaik).

[ShermansWar]

sherman, the Katyusha is effective only when used in large numbers over a short time. the ability to do so is a big advantage of rockets over the slower firing howitzers.
by using sporadic rockets (as many as 10) to attack cities is ineffective.

f

Sure, I agree.The way it is employed by hezbollah against israel is ineffective militarily, but i thought for you to have said the weapon itself is inneffective was misleading, althoug unintentional. I was just making the point that it is not a weapons system to be discounted in general.

While it's use militarily is insignificant, politically it is quite effective, and has drawn quite a response from israel.unfortunately israel's response has left it somewhat isolated as it is getting criticism for disproportionate response, but myself i think such criticism is silly. How does the UN think it has the right to tell any sovereign nation that, when attacked, how it can respond?I hope yopu guys stomp hezbollah, although i suspect that, as when we went into fallujah, most real worthwhile islamic military assets will already be withdrawn from the area, and some fanatics left behind to fight you guys while the bulk of their materie'l gets away.You guys need to establish a buffer zone,which is politically costly for you,or the alternative being israeli cities getting rocketed.

[CriticalMass]

And today's Katyusha news: Iraqi army 'saves British troops' (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/5206284.stm)

[ShermansWar]

Hizballah Rockets

Hizballah’s militia is a light force, equipped with small arms, such as automatic rifles, mortars, rocket-propelled grenades, and Katyusha rockets, which it occasionally has fired on towns in northern Israel. US officials say it did not have truck-mounted multiple launch systems for the Katyushas as of 1995. Instead, the rockets are normally fired from improvised static launchers, sometimes consisting of little more than a few boards. In this way, the launching crew can leave the area and fire the rocket remotely, safe from Israeli counter-battery fire.

In mid-1993 Hizbollah launched Katyusha rockets on towns in northern Israel, such as Qiryat Shemona. Israel subsequently began striking Hizbollah positions in civilian areas in southern Lebanon in an effort to pressure Syria and Lebanon to curb Hizbollah.

On 11 April 1996 Hizballah fired missiles into Israeli villages and towns, driving a quarter of a million Israelis into bomb shelters or flight. This prompted Israel to launch a massive bombardment of Hizballah bases in southern Lebanon. When Prime Minister Shimon Peres launched Operation Grapes of Wrath, the plan was to whip Hizballah into submission by bludgeoning the landscape until Lebanon and Syria cried uncle. Israel's response against Hizballah was a high-tech blitz, targeting specific buildings and vehicles hiding the enemy, while avoiding civilian casualties. In fact, two ambulances were hit, and three power plants were damaged. On 19 April 1996 Israeli artillery hit a United Nations compound near the village of Kana, where civilians had sought shelter from the attacks. More than 100 are killed. The artillery was directed by modern US-made counterbattery radar, which had tracked the trajectory of Hizballah's Katyusha rockets and spotted the location from which they had been fired. But by the time the Israelis fired, the Shi'ite guerrillas and the Katyusha launcher were gone. The 1996 Grapes of Wrath ceasefire accord stated that Hizballah and Israeli troops must not attack civilian targets or use civilians as cover, even while assaulting each other's forces inside Lebanon.

In 1995 and 1996, during a period of time when Israel was enduring Katyusha rocket attacks from the Hezbollah across its northern borders, the US offered to Israel -- and they accepted -- the Tactical High-Energy Laser system, which they have been working on. It is a system that's designed specifically to deal with Katyusha rocket attacks from across the border. It is a system that Israel and the United States have worked on, and that is one system that they should be able to use if they experience Katyusha rocket attacks.

On 24 May 2000 Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Barak fulfilled a campaign promise and ended Israel's 22-year occupation ofsouthern Lebanon. Hezbollah saw this as a massive victory. In Israel, Barak was under fire for his withdrawal from Lebanon and for being ineffectual with the Palestinians.

In early 2001 it was reported that Hizballah had set up a belt of mobile multi-barreled rocket launchers and truck-mounted missiles along Israel’s northern flank ready to go off the moment Israel launched a large-scale military offensive against Lebanon. The Japanese-made Isuzo truck launchers carry Fajr-3 (Arabic for dawn-3) projectiles, a third generation of Katyusha rockets manufactured by Iran's air force industry.

In October 2002 it was reported that Iranian Zelzal-2 short-range ballistic missiles had been delivered to Iranian Revolutionary Guard units in the Beka'a Valley in Lebanon. Israelis sources frequently claim that long-range rockets have been transferred to Lebanon, including 240mm versions of the standard 122mm 'Katyusha' rocket, and Iranian Fajr-3 and Fajr-5 rockets. The unguided Zelzal-2 ballistic missiles, intended to strike area targets such as communities and cities, are equipped with explosive warheads weighing up to 600 kilograms. The longer range rockets require some expertise to aim and use effectively, which may be beyond the capability of the Hizballah to operate without direct Pasdaran support in the field.

The head of Israeli Military Intelligence reported in 2004 that Hezbollah had 13,000 rockets, most with a 25-kilometer range, about 500 with a range of 45 kilometers [Fajr-3] to 75 kilometers [Fajr-5], and a few dozen with a 115-kilometer range [Zelzal-2]. A senior Military Intelligence officer told the Knesset's Defense and Foreign Affairs Committee in 2006 that Hizbullah possessed thousands of rockets with a 20-kilometer firing range as well as some 100 rockets capable of reaching targets of 40-70 kilometers. Hezbollah had not used the Fajr rockets until the July 2006 conflict.

Iran appears to have furnished Hizballah with their unarmed Mohajer-4 UAV, which was flown over northern Israel on 07 November 2004 and 11 April 2005, both times surprising Israeli air defenses. In November 2004, Hizballah launched an unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) that left Lebanese airspace and flew over the Israeli town of Nahariya before crashing into Lebanese territorial waters. Ten days prior to the event, the Hizballah Secretary General said Hizballah would come up with new measures to counter Israeli Air Force violations of Lebanese airspace.

Hizbollah fighters raided north Israel in a botched attempt to capture Israeli troops November 21, 2005, triggering the worst round of fighting since Israel pulled out from south Lebanon five years ago. Hizbollah also fired salvoes of Katyusha rockets into Israeli posts in the Shebaa Farms. On 28 May 2006 Hezbollah launched a Katyusha barrage at an IDF base on Mt. Meron. Israel responded immediately by hitting a number of Hezbollah positions along the border.

On 13 July 2006 Hizbullah launched a rocket at Haifa. Minutes before the firing, Hizbullah's al-Manar showed a new rocket which they said will hit "the strongholds of the Zionist enemy." The Hizbullah said they fired a Ra'ad 1 missile at Israel. "That's the missile used by Hizbullah to respond to Israeli attack and to hit military strongholds of the Zionist enemy. The rocket is of 333 mm in diameter and has a warhead of 100 kilograms. Our fighters used it today when they attacked the military base in Har Meron which was severely damaged and set on fire." However, an examination of the rocket depicted in the television newscast makes clear that it is not the 45-km range Fadjr-3, but rather the Shahin-1, which has a range of only 13 km.

Al-Quran Sura 13, ar-Ra'ad, takes its name from the word (ar-Ra'ad) (thunder) that occurs in verse 13: "The thunder praises His glory, and so do the angels, out of reverence for Him. He sends the lightning bolts, which strike in accordance with His will. Yet, they argue about GOD, though His power is awesome." Allah impressed on the Believers that they should not lose heart, if He is giving the enemies of the Truth a rope long enough to hang themselves.

Hizballah seriously damaged a Saar 5-class missile ship named the "Spear" that was helping to enforce Israel's blockade of Lebanon on 14 July 2006. One Israeli sailor was killed and three were initially missing after the attack. Israel initially believed that an aerial drone armed with explosives hit the warship, but it became clear that Hizballah had used an Iranian-made C-802 cruise missile to strike the vessel. Another Hizballah radar-guided anti-ship missile hit and sank a nearby Cambodian merchant ship around the time the Spear was struck. Twelve Egyptian sailors were pulled from the water by passing ships.

As of 15 July 2006 it was reported that about 350 rockets had been fired into Israel in the current round of fighting, representing a massive escalation above the previous harassing fire of random rounds against border settlements and Israeli military targets. As of 18 July 2006 it was reported that Hizballah had fired more than 700 rockets into Israel, representing a sustained rate of fire of about 100 rockets per day since fighting errupted on 12 July 2006..

[nimo]

ShermansWar you missed the main reason to this last round of fire - in 12 of July the hezbollah kidnap 2 soldiers from Israel and killed 8

[ShermansWar]

I didnt miss that.nor am i unaware that the town of sderot has been under bombardment for most of this year from gaza.

the main reason they went in is because of these constant attacks. the kidnappings of the israeli soldiers was the catalyst, but this has been brewing for some time, IMHO.

Point being, the israelis arent saying " give us our soldiers back and we'll leave". they are saying they wont leave until hezbollah no longer has the ability to fire into israel.

[Razman23]

All these years, and that Katusha is still an effective weapons system.

Are they using the truck, or firing them from another "Jerry rigged" system?


Depends on what you consider effective. Its a blanket cover no guidance shoot and scoot type weapon. Its about as accurate as a bottle rocket on the fourth. These things were built in bulk because they are cheap to make and easy to store.

I have seen pictures of the rail system mounted on back of trucks, cars, pickups and even on the ground. I saw a video of one rocket launched from a slope of a ditch with a V groove dug into the slope of the ditch as a guidence rail. :shock:

If you go to www.ogrish.com, you can see a couple of videos of rockets being launched from the woods as well as the IDF response.

[nimo]

i live about 5 miles (8 KM) from Lebanon - Israel border, and ween a Katusha is fired we usually can hear a small expulsion then we count 3 sec for impact.
can some one tell me what is that small explosion at the lunch? if it's a rocket doesn't it supposed to make a whoosh sound?

[Ssnake]

Is the rocket super- or subsonic?
Could be a supersonic bang or "compressed" sound waves of a missile arriving at almost sonic speed as it's passing you on its way to the impact location.

[Ssnake]

Oh, Sherman: As much as I welcome your return from the silent zone, I think that instead of lengthy quotes from other web sites without giving the source you should rather post a link to such an article. At the very least, post the source as well. But brevity would be even better.

[nimo]

Is the rocket super- or subsonic?
Could be a supersonic bang or "compressed" sound waves of a missile arriving at almost sonic speed as it's passing you on its way to the impact location.

i don't think its supersonic because i can hear the lunch way before the impact (which is near me).
maybe its the gas expanding around the lunch area, any one knows for how long the rocket engine work until it reach maximum speed?

[MajorMagee]

Nimo,

The initial firing sound travels at the speed of sound over the ground on a direct line to your ear. Even a fast round travels in a high arc, and arrives some moments later.

In a vacuum, a round traveling at 280 m/s, and fired at an angle of 45 deg. will take about 40 sec to travel its max range of 8 km. The launch sound would only take 23.5 seconds to travel 8km along the ground if it could carry that far.

A supersonic round could be fired at a shallower angle, and reach the target in less time. To get a 3 sec differential the round would have to be fired at a 23 deg angle, and be traveling at 330 m/s. (Slightly less than supersonic at sea level.)

The other more likely possibility is that you're not hearing the launch, but rather, the sonic boom of the round. This can happen when a supersonic round slows below supersonic during the course of its flight. For a three second difference, the round simply needs to slow enough over the course of time to fall 1km behind the boom it created.

[nimo]

MajorMagee you really take that one seriously - thanks.

[ShermansWar]

Oh, Sherman: As much as I welcome your return from the silent zone, I think that instead of lengthy quotes from other web sites without giving the source you should rather post a link to such an article. At the very least, post the source as well. But brevity would be even better.

Yes , boss.

one of the articles was from a link already posted, the other i thought i attributed to global security .org, the first was from wikipedia.

no fun just posting the links, half the time i see guys posting links, noone bothers to read them, so at least the info is in front of you, is my logic, i guess.

as far as not attributing the webistes, i dont hide where there from, i just dont post the links.i'm too lazy to see if i'm engaging in copyright infringement, so i just leave out the links and let you guys figure it out. You can delete them if you like, but i dont think either article said dont reproduce.

[ShermansWar]

Also, Sherman doesnt do Brevity. :twisted:

[NEpi]

sherman, one correction: israeli demands are "bring us the two soldiers back and go away", not just "go away". the problem is the going away is the hard part, that captures all attention.

[GGTharos]

as far as not attributing the webistes, i dont hide where there from, i just dont post the links.i'm too lazy to see if i'm engaging in copyright infringement, so i just leave out the links and let you guys figure it out. You can delete them if you like, but i dont think either article said dont reproduce.

You're engaging in plagiarism; by not attributing the source and not referencing it you are implying that the material is yours at the least, wether you like it or not, and making it harder for everyone go check out the sources for themselves and possibly branch out into further research of their own from there.

Copy and paste a link along with the huge chunk of text you already copied and pasted, it doesn't really deprive you of anything ;)

[ShermansWar]

Sue me. Yeah, that's what i was doing, Plagarism.I'm a serial Plagarist. I never come up with my own ideas.I never write my own posts. I just Plagarize. I do no service passing on information. Your right. I'm a first class douchebag.I thought I had everyone fooled,because, you know, the presentation didnt look like it was lifted straight out of somewhere else.It looked like I altered it and made it up myself, no?Also, I thought I fooled all those guys that had already looked up the link from wikipedia that someone else posted.I figured they all forgot.
But you were too smart.

Copying and pasting the link means I have to go BACK to the site, and push all those extra buttons, too much work.I'm Lazy.I dont like doing any research and looking into things.I'm just Lazy. Sorry man, I didnt mean to deprive you of additional info. My sincere apologies. :mrgreen:

[12Alfa]

More tin foil please............

[ShermansWar]

And my deepest sincerest apologies to you also, sir.

[12Alfa]

hehehehehe

[chrisotto]

Sherm, what's with the new avatar?

[12Alfa]

The RED Hulk?

[Lone*star49]

The RED Hulk?
...

Naw, it's BIG BROTHER watching and controlling all of us..


LS :wink:


PS.. most effective IMO.. lol

[ShermansWar]

It is , as always, the face of William Tecumseh Sherman, the Father of modern warfare.It seemd to me to be an abstract vision of the face of war, so i adopted it. You guys no like?

[chrisotto]

Sherm, me like very much. Has something very artistic, stylish, dreadfull and threatening to it.

[Trekker]

It is , as always, the face of William Tecumseh Sherman, the Father of modern warfare.It seemd to me to be an abstract vision of the face of war, so i adopted it. You guys no like?

How come he's considered the father of modern warfare? Please enlight me :)

[Razman23]

How come he's considered the father of modern warfare? Please enlight me :)


Sherman------------------->Sherman tank.

Get it?

LOL.

[Razman23]

ShermansWar you missed the main reason to this last round of fire - in 12 of July the hezbollah kidnap 2 soldiers from Israel and killed 8

And yet how many IDF have died since this started? Why are these two soldiers so important that other soldiers dying is not a issue? Seems kind of a twisted thinking if you ask me.

[nimo]

And yet how many IDF have died since this started? Why are these two soldiers so important that other soldiers dying is not a issue? Seems kind of a twisted thinking if you ask me.

i made that comment after mistakenly thinking Sherm was listing all event between Hezbollah and israel, i thought he missed one event but later noted by him that he was referring missiles and rockets events only.

the return of the soldiers is important but it is not the main objective of the latest fighting.

i don't want it to get political or anything, if you have more to say please go to http://sbfs.wolvenshire.com/ and make your comment

[Chaplain]

And yet how many IDF have died since this started? Why are these two soldiers so important that other soldiers dying is not a issue? Seems kind of a twisted thinking if you ask me.

The US Military has long pursued the concept of "No man left behind." Our military has often risked many lives to gain back a handful of men who were injured/surrounded/shot down/etc.

Remember, the IDF is not sending their soldiers to die over two captured men - they are sending them in to fight and destroy the enemy who captured those men.

[Volcano]

And yet how many IDF have died since this started? Why are these two soldiers so important that other soldiers dying is not a issue? Seems kind of a twisted thinking if you ask me.

It is a matter of principle.

Elaboration: If you are Hezbollah and you abduct two soldiers (not capture as they were not at war) and this act sparks a limited war in which most of your forces were totally destroyed, then no matter how many casualties you inflicted you will no doubt think twice about doing something like that in the future, would you not?

[ShermansWar]

How come he's considered the father of modern warfare? Please enlight me :)

I've given this schpiel before, but, OK, you twisted my arm,lol.

In the aftermath of the First World War, the British Army observed that they had just fought a war with modern weapons, using what were, essentially, the tactics first developed by Frederick the Great, (also frequently reffered to as "Napoleonic tactics,")with dreadful consequences. The mass casualties of the first world war were horriffic, and they had no desire to repeat them in a future war.

They asked one of their officers, a bright young fellow associated with their new armoured branch, an officer, one Henry Basil Liddell Hart ,to study the problem and come up with reccomendations .It was suggested to him that he should study the American Civil War, because they felt that the Americans had dealt with the same problem, Modern weapons, and had the same mass casualty results.

He was asked to pick an American officer and how he dealt with the situation, "Preferably Lee". As he studied the war, he found the more he dug, the more he found Sherman, not Lee, was his man.

Consider, the army under Robert E Lee went back and forth over the same stinking 60 mile stretch of land between Washington and Richmond( the confederate capitol) for 4 years. It ended in a 9 month seige around Petersburg, and was essentially no different than any of the campaigns of the Great War.

Sherman and his army of the west, on the other hand, covered and marched over 2400 miles during the war. Clearly, Sherman had discovered how to restore mobility to his forces on a modern battlefield.

Liddel Hart wrote his book, called simply "Sherman". A year later, he wrote another, called "Sherman and the strategy of the indirect approach".

The Germans read them, applied the theories therein, and came up with the Blitzkreig.

Liddells Harts writings on Sherman were studied by Guderian, Rommel, Zhukov, Degualle, Leclerc, Patton.The Ideas Lidell Hart espoused, developed from his study of Shermans methods, are the foundations for modern maneuver warfare.

At the center of all his ideas,is the presumption that, as you advance directly against your enemies defenses, your casualties mount exponentially as your enemies defensive perimiter becomes compressed the further you advance against him, leading to ever higher losses.This is what happenned in the First World War.

Sherman, on the other hand, would travel over mountains, through swamps, Dig canals,Build bridges, railroads, any type of feat of logistics or engineering to keep from having to make a frontal assault on his enemy.His methods, are, in fact, how we maneuver even on the SB battlefield.

His army worked, and worked hard.
His principle adversary, Gen Joseph Johnston said, when he heard Shermans' army was advancing 20 miles a day through the impenetrable swamps of Georgia by laying corduroy roads,
" The world has seen no such army since the days of Julius Ceasar".

The end run around the Maginot line through the Ardennes, the "Hail Mary" attack by Schwarzkpf through the open Iraqi desert are easily understandable examples.

Sherman advocated advancing on multiple axis of advance, with mutually supporting columns with no definitive fixed objective, but rather, would bypass main enemy concentrations so as to strike at their lines of communication, suply bases and depots, command and control centers, crippling his enemy and leaving them unable to react to his swift movements.Wherever the enemy massed against him, he would simply shift the weight of his advance to another column, reroute the obstructed one, and keep moving. If one column became embroiled, the others would come to it's aid.

When The rebels became surrounded and cutoff, they either surrendered, or were bypassed and became irreleavant, while he struck at the enemies industrial base and destroyed the ability of the south to support it's armies in the field.

He is the first modern general to specifically target the enemies infrastructure in a comprehensive thought out approach so as to both:
A) Destroy the will of the enemy civilian populace to fight and support their armies by increasing their discomfort to intolerable levels without actually killing or starving them, and
B) Destroying the industrial capabilities of a nation so they cannot arm, equip, supply , command or communicate effectively with their armies.

Lee's defeat after 9 months at Petersburg was not due to any manuevers or efforts by Grant, his direct opponenet, but rather by the starvation, lack of supplies, desertions of soldiers hearing worrisome news from their homes and famiies, (caused by Shermans March), and , ultimately, by the approach of Shermans army marching up through the carolinas , threatening lee's rear, and making his situation at petersburg untenable. That, in the end, is what finally caused him to abandon his works and surrender at Appomatox a few weeks later.Sherman had marched his army all the way from the west to the east, from the mississippi to the Atlantic.


He recognized, before the war started, that control of the Mississippi would be the key to the war, ( he who controls the Mississippi controls the interior lines of communication , with all the rivers that branch off of it, the ohio, the cumberland, the tenessee, etc) and control of the railines.It was said he was a born quartermaster. Wherever his army went, the railhead followed right behind. He always had his army supplied, and his railines ran almost into his trenches. He knew how to fight a war of materiel'.


Yet, his most famous attack was his March to the Sea, from recently seized Atlanta, ( the main communication, industrial and supply hub of the south, from where all their supplies came) through the swamps of Georgia, the heart of the south, and straight through to the Atlantic.

The Union Had bisected the South when they gained control of the Mississippi river, and they bisected it again when Sherman marched to the sea.They chopped the southt into little peices that couldnt communicate or support each other.

He had no clear announced objective. But what he did, this born quartermatser, this lifelong railroad man, was to leave his base of operations, abandon his lines of communication, leaving everything and everyone behind, and striking deep into the very Bowels of the South.
He had bypassed or defeated every worthwhile Southern army,and now he targeted their heartland, their industry, their homes, their pride, their will to fight.

Before he made the march, Grant asked him if he really thought he could do it without getting cutoff and surrounded, destroyed, with no help available from anywhere. He replied:
"I can make the march, and I will make Georgia howl.I will make war so terrible for them, they will not appeal to it again for generations."

While in Atlanta,during the preparations for his march, he was told the Confederate general he had just evicted from the city was taking his army and heading north, into Union lands, into Tennessee. It was suggested that he immediately pursue him and stop him, lest he threaten northern cities and lines of communication. Sherman replied " If Gen. Hood will go to Tenessee, then I will send him rations. My business is down South."

The seige of Atlanta was a long and bitter struggle,Sherman finally forcing the rebels to abandon the city after a climactic battle after and then, Shermans cavalry cutting the last of over a dozen railines leading into the city.

He stayed in the city less than a month, refitted his army, sent the bulK of it north, and took a corps of experienced hardened veterans and began his march to the sea.He burnt the city to the ground as he left, and Blazed his way across Georgia, destroying every worthwhile economic asset along the way.

Ultimately, he emerged from the wilderness at the port of Savannah, on the coast where the Georgia and South Carolina border meet. He took Savannah after a breif battle, and then, after a short stay, took off after the rebel armies into the Carolinas, turning North,and heading up the Atlantic Coast, toward Richmond and Petersburg.

As he advanced through the Carolinas, the devastation became truly horriffic,entire cities destroyed, as he felt South Carolina had done more to cause the war and her fate should be much worse than Georgia's. They burnt every mill, every plantation, every govt building, looted all the warehouses, and lived off the land and what they could confiscate.It was a bold stroke for a guy who never ventured away from his Lines of communication and supply.They left a swath of destruction 50 miles wide through the South( for that is how wide Sherman had staggered his 3 mutually supporting columns). It was one of the most bloodless campains of the war. Loss of life on both sides was minimal,but the ability of the south to fight had been destroyed.

It may have been one of the most bloodless campaigns in history, but the South does not remeber it that way. They still spit at the mention of his name, and my screename still pisses off southern boys even in these forums.

Sherman was a guy that knew how to destroy the enemies ability to wage war, destroy their will to fight, and maneuver his forces.The foragers for his armies, his "Bummers" became the foundation for the modern fireteam and it's tactics. Modern Air campaigns are aimed at acheving the same goals that Shermans campaigns were aimed at. He fought with minimal loss of life, preserved his force, and used it with maximum impact, concentrating at the point of attack, while maneuvering dispersed and attacking always at an unexpected time, in an unexpected place.It is his Philisophy of destroying an enemies infrastructure and means to wage war that has earned him the title " The Father of Modern Warfare" although the most profound effect he had was shapiing the way that modern armoured forces fight.

[ShermansWar]

Goddammit, wont let me write posts longer than 10,000 characters.

[Ssnake]

Sue me. Yeah, that's what i was doing, Plagarism.
You're not the victim, so don't adopt that attitude.

It would be so much easier to just post the link. You can use copy & paste technique as well - from the browser URL line. There's no need to switch into a mood of aggressive catatonism - just post the link.

Even better, post the link and then your own opinion. A forum is to express one's opinion in the first place, and not to copy & paste lengthy articles.

[ShermansWar]

You're not the victim, so don't adopt that attitude.

It would be so much easier to just post the link. You can use copy & paste technique as well - from the browser URL line. There's no need to switch into a mood of aggressive catatonism - just post the link.

Even better, post the link and then your own opinion. A forum is to express one's opinion in the first place, and not to copy & paste lengthy articles.

Good one, boss. I had to go look that one up

Actually, I did in fact feel the need for agressive catatonism, as being accused of plagarism evinced an evisceral reaction from me, and, in the spirit of playing nice, I decided that, as opposed to abusing the poster, I would direct towards myself, whilst staying within the forum rules.

While I have no desire or intent to annoy or provoke you, nor will I disrespect you, it is my beleif that, as long as I stay within the forum guidelines, what attitude I have is my own choice, and I feel making the choice of aggressive catatonsim is less objectionable than being belligernt or insulting, which was my natural inclination.

The mans post was pointless, as I had already responded in the AFFIRMATIVE to your request to post the link in the future.The point had already been made, by yourself and at least one other poster,I had already responded, and I considered it bad manners on his part to jump on the bandwagon at that point and proceed to lecture me, this person I know not.As far as I'm concerned, he was merely seizing an opportunity to rub someones nose in shit.Any practical concerns had already been addressed and responded to.

Furthermore, as I said, I found it insulting to be accused of plagarism.That I was guilty is beside the point, IMO.Anyone with half a brain could read the post and see it was lifted straight out of somewhere else, no attempt had been made to alter it.In addition, as previously stated, the link was ALREADY posted. Several persons appreciated me posting the entire article, it was new to them, even though the link had already been posted, which confirms my beleif that simply posting a bunch of links does little to inform those who would like to be informed, but are, like myself, fucking Lazy.
Therefore, in the future, when schlifting someone elses work product, I will in fact post the link,and will, if i deem it relevant, post the entire article.

[Trekker]

Thanks Sherm, now i know alot more about your namesake...

[nimo]

here is a photo i took from the roof of my house today.
the driver parked his car and went to the nearby supermarket, one minute later he received a new paint job.

[TankHunter]

here is a photo i took from the roof of my house today.
the driver parked his car and went to the nearby supermarket, one minute later he received a new paint job.

Oh shit! I hope that all are ok from that one

[Crusty]

Nimo do you get any warning that these rockets are incoming ?
I hope as TankHunter says that all are OK,

Take care.

[nimo]

Nimo do you get any warning that these rockets are incoming ?
I hope as TankHunter says that all are OK,

Take care.
we don't get any official warning (alarm or something like that), but as i was saying in this thread we can hear as small boom then we have 3-5 sec to run for cover.

and yes all are OK, we gut lucky because there is a gas station 15 m' from there.