Gunner problems

[Wildfire]

I recently noticed the ai gunner cannot engage moving targets while the targets ascend or desend hills. The rounds always fall short. Latest example was when I played the Durangle valley sce. I watched the m1 waste every he and ap round trying to engage 1 target. The target was an t80 moving left to right climbing a small hill, distance was appx 1300 meters. I then took over the gunners pos after reloading and attempted to engage other targets and I had the same problem. Any idea what causes this? Or is it a bug? Very frustrating to say the least.

[jimcarrel]

Wildfire, I recently noticed same problem. was playing a scenario where targets where traveling up and down steep hill at an angle. I wasted all KE and HE. I figure the problem is mine. When I thought about it, I rarely come across such a contact situation.

I'm not sure of your case, but I'm sure mine is gunnery skill. Increasing and decreasing distance plus an obtuse angle really puts one in confusion.

My problem at the time was compounded with the distance being 3700 meters. My targets were completely engulfed by lasing reticle. Getting a better handle on first and last return switch, would probably help me also.

That is a real world situation, I'm sure there is probably a firing solution that I haven't learned yet. Maybe a marksman will help out here. Any takers?
JimC.

[Lone*star49]

...

Well, that just leaves one question left to this gunning mystery. Were your tanks on level ground when taking these shots?

I understand (from previous discussions about hits and misses) that if your tank is on any cant, and not on level ground, it throws a curve into the equation of what you see thru the reticle, on-sight, in the sights, dead-on, but really the target is not.. sigh, IIRC.


LS

[Volcano]

If the target is decending the hill then you are going to have to aim below it and if it is ascending the hill you will need to aim above it. Most FCS that I know of do not compensate for elevation changes. Now if the AI is always missing then it perhaps doesn't know the meaning of "kentucky windage".

[Lone*star49]

If the target is decending the hill then you are going to have to aim below it and if it is ascending the hill you will need to aim above it. Most FCS that I know of do not compensate for elevation changes.

>> Now if the AI is always missing then it perhaps doesn't know the meaning of "kentucky windage".
...

>> ROFL V, as this is what seperates the human (gunner) from the AI.. lol


LS

[Ssnake]

If the target is decending the hill then you are going to have to aim below it and if it is ascending the hill you will need to aim above it.
Only if the speed is so high that pretty much any military vehicle could not possibly make it. In fact, regardless of shooting up- or downhill, you always need to aim low, as surprising as that may sound.
To that extent I am surprised that the computer-controlled gunners would miss "short" when in fact they should rather miss "over" if they were just aiming center mass.Most FCS that I know of do not compensate for elevation changes.
Which is why I'm looking forward to adding the Swiss Leo 2A4 one day. There's dynamic lead for both planes...

[Wildfire]

LS, I was on level ground when I had that problem. I also tried a different sce., NTC gunnery on the move, and again the same prob. The tank travels along a dirt road engaging vehicles to the left and right. In fact, some of the engagements occured at slightly lower elevations than my tank, and the ai gunner had the same problem. I find it hard to believe that the ai gunner should miss as often as it does.

[Wildfire]

I tried the NTC gunnery practice (on the move) again. What I noticed is when the ai gunner engages targets ascending a hill the rounds always fall short. When the ai gunner engages targets descending a hill the rounds mostly fall over. This happens when I am on level ground, at a halt or on the move, and the moving targets are moving at slow to fast speed and even at dug in pos. The targets are at a slightly lower or higher elevation than my tank. This is a big problem, espesially if I am playing a sce where I rely on the ai to do its job. Any ideas?

[Lone*star49]

...

Only a question to the Brass.. Did, or have you, fixed the AI gunner accuracy, via one's Tank Range Gun Scores?

Last I heard, unlike in SB1, where one's Score and time, made a big difference in one's AI abilitys to put steel on target, this was not the case in Pro PE, as in a bug.. IIRC.


LS

[jimcarrel]

...

Well, that just leaves one question left to this gunning mystery. Were your tanks on level ground when taking these shots?

I understand (from previous discussions about hits and misses) that if your tank is on any cant, and not on level ground, it throws a curve into the equation of what you see thru the reticle, on-sight, in the sights, dead-on, but really the target is not.. sigh, IIRC.


LS

That was exactly my problem, I had left predetermined route, (and drove thru rather large boulders), throwing left track. Left side was inclined up, I was immobilized.

I was engaging contacts 90 degrees right, down into valley. Now that you mention it, sometimes after dumping lead GPS would end up at confusing destination. Once I had to track back left approx. 10 degrees and up a little to reaquire target.

You bet I wasn't level.
JimC.

[BRGillespie]

It's because of the cannon.

When you lase the target, the computer raises or lowers the barrel of the cannon to the correct degree so the round impacts at the range that the lase came back with.

Now if you're canted to the left <i>badly</i> (if you're on the side of the hill, let's say you canted to the left by 20 degrees) and you lase the target at 1500 meters, the computer is going to raise the barrel so the round impacts at that point. But since you're canted to the left by 30 degrees, instead of the round flying a straight arc to the target, it's going to be traveling off to the left for PART of the flight before gravity takes hold of it.

Consequentially, the round impacts to the LEFT of the desired impact point.

If you know you're badly canted to the left, then you have to aim to the right a bit. Reverse if you're canted to the right.

[Storm91]

...

>> ROFL V, as this is what seperates the human (gunner) from the AI.. lol


LS

Kentucky windage old as time itself .......roflmao

[BRGillespie]

As for shooting uphill or downhill... it's a matter of geometry and gravity and stuff.

Anyway... that's why I prefer playing the Leopards and Bradleys in-game as opposed to the Abrams. That predictive targeting annoys me.