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Old 08-27-2007, 11:01 AM
GH_Lieste GH_Lieste is offline
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Roads and towns on Steep slopes

I've recently begun work on a map.

The terrain is fairly sparse, with some significant relief, and low population. The villages that are present are connected by a few predominantly level roads running along the contours.

This causes a problem as the road has a cross-slope of approximately 45 degrees, making traction interesting. When the road runs through a number of houses located at flatish bits of this terrain, but still steeper on average than say 10 degrees, the road degenerates into a chaotic mess, as each house claims a large flat plot for itself, regardless of proximity to the road or to each other, and indeed with little relationship with the building size.. the SB1 carry overs seem to have larger than average plot sizes (or are smaller buildings?)


I was somewhat dismayed by the inability to use roads correctly in this type of terrain, as the road should give a nice smooth, flat and stable surface for fast driving (so long as you don't miss the corners or drive too fast ), and therefore excellent (if overly predictable) BP with no appreciable trunnion cant.

As a temporary expedient, I have added a chain of bridge elements along the line of the original road, and with some provisos the effect is similar to what the roads should be. The bridge deck merely joins the two elevation points at each end in a straight line, and doesn't visually modify the underlying terrain (so partial intrusions of the underlying hill side occur to approximately the centre line of the road section). It does however give a nice flat driving surface, good BPs. It isn't possible to get good junctions with adjoining sections or particularly side-roads, and SB doesn't chain them together. Care needs to be taken not to collide with the walls near corners, as collisions with the ends/outsides of the wall are effective, even though it is possible to drive through them when leaving the road...

Despite looking a bit rough round the edges, and obviously being an abuse of the designed function of these objects, I think it is a significant improvement of the driving experience on this type of road.

Very early WIP:
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Old 08-27-2007, 01:00 PM
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Re: Roads and towns on Steep slopes

Well, a creative solution I have to admit.
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Old 08-27-2007, 01:05 PM
GH_Lieste GH_Lieste is offline
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Re: Roads and towns on Steep slopes

Well, I noticed how the bridges over the streams didn't follow the slope, and thought to myself can I place bridges just anywhere... and it grew from that..

But it is, and looks a bodge.. so:

How far down THE LIST is proper 3d roads, with embankments and cuttings as required, and an overhaul of the town flattening?
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Old 11-05-2009, 12:13 AM
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Re: Roads and towns on Steep slopes

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Originally Posted by GH_Lieste View Post
How far down THE LIST is proper 3d roads, with embankments and cuttings as required, and an overhaul of the town flattening?
The idea of 3D roads has been haunting me ever since PE came out. Especially since its likely to be never implemented - however it would be AWESOME to have 3D roads (especially railroads) that are not just a flat textures on the ground.
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Old 11-05-2009, 12:14 AM
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Re: Roads and towns on Steep slopes

It's more complicated than it looks.
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Old 11-05-2009, 01:14 AM
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Arrow Re: Roads and towns on Steep slopes

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Originally Posted by daskal View Post
The idea of 3D roads has been haunting me ever since PE came out. Especially since its likely to be never implemented...
Can't confirm that assertion. It has been identified as an "important" and "desirable" element. It's just that the change isn't trivial, so timing is essential in the context of a proper development plan. (see the other thread for details)
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Old 11-05-2009, 03:09 AM
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Re: Roads and towns on Steep slopes

@ Ssnake and DarkAngel.....How hard would it be to create a sculpting tool that could shape features at a smaller scale than current map resolutions used to generate height maps.

Is SB locked to reproducing only what is publicly available ....DTEDs and such or can it go 1M or smaller and deal with shorter elevation distance changes?

Guessing since we have vehicle emplacements that can change size and bumpiness and trenches in the old SB ...it is possible to make custom features..we just need to make a palette of "terrain" feature like we have for houses.

Engineered roads would be a first start great!

Instead of Height/Terrain...what would be needed is Height/Engineered/Terrain
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Old 11-05-2009, 10:54 AM
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Re: Roads and towns on Steep slopes

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Originally Posted by Ssnake View Post
Can't confirm that assertion. It has been identified as an "important" and "desirable" element. It's just that the change isn't trivial, so timing is essential in the context of a proper development plan. (see the other thread for details)
Yes I think that's clear to everyone, I just wished you guys would just wake up one morning with a feel of a gigantic enthusiasim & desire to go further than it's "required" and raise the bar not contemplating wheter some new feature is being payed for or not. I know I'm a bit carried away with this as I am viewing things from a personal customer view - if I would be in your shoes I would manage things probably the same way.

But still, some "F*ck it, lets do this anyway" mentality would be cool from time to time
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Old 11-05-2009, 10:30 PM
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Re: Roads and towns on Steep slopes

Sure, but a what price?

Even if the guys could do the modelling "now" what are the impacts?

Does the size of the map need to shrink to something nearly useless (say 2km x 2km) so the "average" user's PC can do all the computations required, or do you put on the system requirements "Cray required" and then get a tsunami of complaints that no one can use it on their existing machine?

There's a trade off required for this sort of detail.
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Last edited by Gibsonm; 11-06-2009 at 01:21 AM.
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Old 11-05-2009, 10:43 PM
GH_Lieste GH_Lieste is offline
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Re: Roads and towns on Steep slopes

Some of that trade off might be to wait until the 'entry-level' machine(s) can cope with the required number of calculations... It would still hurt those with 'existing' low and mid-range machines, but it is more likely to be successful than requiring top-end(-or-above) machines today.
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