Aust CO-OP Campaign - Thoughts Mission #2

Mission 2 comprises an assault to clear NEWCASTLE (or parts thereof - more on that later) to form the other half of the operation to reopen the Port.

Having dragged some of you out of your comfort zone to crew recon vehicles, this one does something similar in that you maybe "in" a tk or commanding some Mech Inf. Added to this the German volunteers should have finished their conversion trg by the weekend after next so potentially we have more players to find seats for.

Lots of Tk commanders suggest lots more Mech Inf and I'm unsure how that will run over the 'net?

I'm currently thinking of an activity along these lines:

Options:

1. AS BG(+) atk against Red Coy / Coy(+) (that is the black boundary isn't there).

This gives me approx. 5 Tk TP/PL comd spots (or 20 or so veh comd spots) plus 5 Coy of AI Mech Inf.

Whilst confident of running this in a classroom over a LAN, I suspect over the Internet there will be some "yawn" moments.

2. The black boundary is in effect and the attack above the boundary becomes the 2 x Coy, 2 x Tp one.

This gives me roughly 3 TP ldr spots but narrows the frontage significantly, which may or may not improve performance?

I'm thinking that Option 2 is more workable and we move to a model of more experienced players fill the TP ldr spots and junior vehicles in each TP are manned by people instead of AI (along the lines of the 3ACR campaign).

I'd plot the routes for the Mech Inf and let the AI run them.

2a. A branch from "2" is to have human Tk TP ldrs and the remainder command a Mech Inf PL each. No doubt some would prefer to blaze away from a turret but there maybe some whose background is Mech Inf / PzGdr and would prefer to command a PL from the F5 / F8 world?

Thoughts?

In the end its not a democracy but I'd like to build something that at least some of you are happy with.

Oh and here's one for Kingtiger.

BG Tiger (4 x Mech Coy + 1 x Tk Sqn) would have an echelon of roughly:

8 x APC (Eng)

4 x APC (Amb)

16 x APC

2 x M88

18 x Light Trucks

22 x Mdm Trucks

7 x Hvy Trucks

Do you want it all on the map?

Do you want it all on the map?

eeeeeh.... No...

Will I be supporting 4 Coys/Sqn Simultaneously?

I dont know how this translates into ADF TO&E structure, but for supporting 4 Coys/Sqn simultaneusly I would suggest this setup:

4x Coy/Sqn Combat Support Unit with:

1 M88

1 ASLAV-A

1 M113REP

1 ASLAV-25

BG Log. Unit with:

4 FUEL truck

4 AMMO truck

4 REP Truck

2 M88

2 ASLAV-A

1 ASLAV-25

BG Log will have a separate C/S so those units don't get mixed up with the CS part.

That's the most flexible and versatile setup I can think of in SB terms supporting a big BG like you mentioned.

No ASLAVs.

The CAV unit is in BG EAGLE (thought you would have picked up on that, having just served there. ).

BG TIGER is a Mech Inf Bn complete with a Tk Sqn added (4 x Mech Coy, 1 x Spt Coy, 1 x Tk Sqn. So M1A1 AIM and M113AS4 are the order of the day).

The COMD has reinforced the Mech Bn rather than the usual "swap" of sub units in view of the expected urban fight and need for lots of grunts.

So you'll have M113 APC (Amb) and no ASLAV-25.

Also only have 2 x M88 for the BG (maybe able to stretch to 3) but not enough for nice neat symmetrical packets you've asked for. These are in the Tk Regt and the Sqn only get one normally so the Regt CO has already given you 2 more than you'd normally have (joys of being ME).

However I'll try and build some "packets" along the lines you asked for (and what you asked for in the earlier mission) - just wanted to give you a fright with what you "should have" (and the related real estate issues).

Say:

4 x Coy/Sqn CSS Gp (two icons):

1 M113 (Amb)

1 M113 REP

1 x Ural (Fuel)

1 x Ural (Cargo)

1 x Ural (Repair)

BG Log. Unit with (eight icons):

4 x MRH 90 (AME)

1 x M88

1 M113 REP

1 x M88

1 M113 REP

2 x M113 Amb

2 x M113 Amb

1 x Ural (Fuel)

1 x Ural (Cargo)

1 x Ural (Repair)

1 x Ural (Fuel)

1 x Ural (Cargo)

1 x Ural (Repair)

1 x Ural (Fuel)

1 x Ural (Cargo)

1 x Ural (Repair)

well that have to work I guess. can I have a M113AS4 or a bushmaster as a CO vehicle?

Im a bit supprised of your total lack of ARVs... Swedish mech Bn have 4!

every Tk and Cv Coy as a combat support of:

1 CV90 (in my time it was a PBV302) for the QM (that was my ride )

1 PBV302DSG (M113REP)

1 ARV (bgbv 90/120 depending if 90 Coy or a tk coy)

3 PBV302SJV (M113MED, in my time we only had 2 per Coy but that TOE say 3. However they are Bn assets so can be relocated as needed.)

M113AS4 all yours.

Maybe able to scrape some more up as the mech guys do have M113 based recovery veh and may just have to use M88 as a fill in.

Based on that I could give you a M88 in that Coy/Sqn CSS Gp so each of those would now be:

1 x M88

1 x M113 (Amb)

1 x M113 REP

1 x Ural (Fuel)

1 x Ural (Cargo)

1 x Ural (Repair)

and remove one of the M88 / M113 Rep pairings from the BG level, to give you:

BG Log. Unit with (seven icons):

4 x MRH 90 (AME)

1 x M88

1 x M113 REP

2 x M113 Amb

2 x M113 Amb

1 x Ural (Fuel)

1 x Ural (Cargo)

1 x Ural (Repair)

1 x Ural (Fuel)

1 x Ural (Cargo)

1 x Ural (Repair)

1 x Ural (Fuel)

1 x Ural (Cargo)

1 x Ural (Repair)

"In the end its not a democracy but I'd like to build something that at least some of you are happy with."

At the end of the day, I'll be happy to man what I'm told to man, go where I'm told to go and do what I'm told to do. Preferences? Sure. In order of priority: recce, tank, infantry, echelon...but note what I'll be happy to do.

If possible, be nice to find out what we'll be tasked to do prior to STARTEX, if only to brush up on a few niceties. Looking forward to the next mission!

Well I'm afraid no Recce this time (that was Mission #1).

As to an outline of tasking etc. read the background brief and orders for Mission #1 and they pretty much set the standard for tasking and pre mission briefing:

http://www.steelbeasts.com/sbforums/showthread.php?t=15180

http://www.steelbeasts.com/sbforums/showthread.php?t=15185

some modification to lower the amount of units used:

1 x M88

1 x M113 (Amb)

1 x M113 REP

1 x Ural (Fuel)

1 x Ural (Cargo)

1 x Ural (Repair) Delete - (the M113REP will take care of the easy repairs, if its any longer repair it will go to BG REP anyway)

and remove one of the M88 / M113 Rep pairings from the BG level, to give you:

BG Log. Unit with (seven icons):

4 x MRH 90 (AME) Delete 2. Doubt I will medevac that much with AME. If we had wounded grunts etc to be evacuated 4 would be justified

1 x M88

1 x M113 REP

2 x M113 Amb

2 x M113 Amb Delete - The above should be sufficient in combination with the Sqn/Coy M113MED. Only time BG MED assets is used is when a vehicles is hvy damaged and will be repaired by BG assets AND have casualtys at the same time. If a vehicle only have crew casualtys the Sqn/Coy Med asset will be used.

1 x Ural (Fuel)

1 x Ural (Cargo)

1 x Ural (Repair)

1 x Ural (Fuel)

1 x Ural (Cargo)

1 x Ural (Repair)

1 x Ural (Fuel)

1 x Ural (Cargo)

1 x Ural (Repair)

This should be best structure for a fluid and effective CSS work. Its nice to see rear echelon work being displayed in SB. To much focus on combat part only in my humble opinion

OK so we have a CSS structure of:

4 x Coy / Sqn teams each of two icons:

1 x M88

1 x M113 (Amb)

1 x M113 REP

1 x Ural (Fuel)

1 x Ural (Cargo)

BG Log. Unit with (eight icons):

1 x M88

1 x M113 REP

1 x MRH 90 (AME)

1 x MRH 90 (AME)

1 x M113 Amb

1 x M113 Amb

1 x Ural (Fuel)

1 x Ural (Cargo)

1 x Ural (Repair)

1 x Ural (Fuel)

1 x Ural (Cargo)

1 x Ural (Repair)

1 x Ural (Fuel)

1 x Ural (Cargo)

1 x Ural (Repair)

I split the Amb and the MRH90 so they can move independently (e.g. 1 x helo per sortie or 1 x Amb per trip).

Now that we have the 1/4 shop sorted out all we need are the war fighters to give their opionions.

If no one says anything by 1000 tomorrow (my time), i.e. 48 hours after posting, I'll crack on with what is currently forming as my preferred COA anyway (something along the lines of a dismounted night attack in the rain. ).

Looking real good now, exept this:

I split the Amb and the MRH90 so they can move independently (e.g. 1 x helo per sortie or 1 x Amb per trip).

Prefer having them as sections. If I only need one ambulances I can detach the unit and send it on its way. But having complete sections is much easier to handle when there is low activity for them but higher activity for me somewhere else. like you have 2 icons on the map that you have to give new route to instead of 4 single icons that needs to be coordinated so they don't bunch up at WPs etc.

Greets...

We'll be happy do join for this mission. Looks like a tough one...given the size of the town!!

Just one question on the attacks: Are they all marked as main effort :-? ...or do I get the pic wrong?

Just one question on the attacks: Are they all marked as main effort :-? ...or do I get the pic wrong?

No just me being lazy.

One option called for all three atks across the entire frontage of the city.

Another reduced the frontage by putting in a boundary (effectively the southern most atk on the sketch is done by another unit (outside the scope of the scenario)).

In that reduced AO, the Northern atk would be no change, and the middle atk would be made into a 2 Coy assault. This would mean the 4 Coy BG would have "3 Up and 1 in Reserve".

The sketch is just that, useful as a start point for discussion.

My larger concern is a "troops to task" issue. I don't want to say the first four people get to be Tk TP / PL commanders and anyone after that is a Mech PL commander (apart from the dedicated Arty / Log guys).

Hence the inital question of manning up the Tk TP / PLs or leaving them as one person per TP / PL and allocating everyone else to Mech PLs (that may not be a popular choice)?

2a. A branch from "2" is to have human Tk TP ldrs and the remainder command a Mech Inf PL each. No doubt some would prefer to blaze away from a turret but there maybe some whose background is Mech Inf / PzGdr and would prefer to command a PL from the F5 / F8 world?

I'd take a Mech plt any day :-)

Now that we have the 1/4 shop sorted out all we need are the war fighters to give their opionions.

If no one says anything by 1000 tomorrow (my time), i.e. 48 hours after posting, I'll crack on with what is currently forming as my preferred COA anyway (something along the lines of a dismounted night attack in the rain. ).

Artillery, lots and lots of Artillery.

Or at least knowing how it is divided up would be a start.

I think last time it was 3 batteries of 4 guns, but last mission, I, er, forgot and tasked fire missions using 2 guns. :redface:

Damn you Zip with your funny artillery setups

I'm guessing it'll only be HE & Smk, DPICM does make a mess, 227kgs of High Ex even more so, but it does remove the enemy's ability to fight, and is a great way of facilitating urban renewal. :biggrin:

(Never really been a fan of "Gozerian".)

No you had Troops of 2 guns each (and will again) so what you did was right.

With the new vehicle we are going away from 3 Btys per Regt with 6 guns per Bty.

Now you get 3 Btys but each Bty has 3 TPs of two guns each (same number of tubes but more flexible). If you get confused look at the "placeholders" as you will have 6 of them to worry about and each will have a strength of two.

So here you'll have:

Bn's MOR: 8 tubes

2 Btys of Mdm (the third is doing the CAV spt - concurrent task): 12 tubes in 6 TPs

CAS

So that's say 7 fire units (MOR PL as a fire unit) plus the CAS sorties.

Natures: Still no FASCAM and limited DPICM (for use in the paddocks only)

Still in the JOST / JTAC space (but not controlled by you):

1. I'm looking at an airborne ABF / SBF from 2 x TPs of ARH (say surged to 8 airframes on station) but controlled by the AI.

2. And there will probably be another Tk Sqn on the ground doing ABF / SBF duties that the BG will conduct a Fwd POL through (i.e. they are holding "our" LD for us).

Of course the more guns you want, the more trucks I have to load KT up with to feed them.

Enough toys?

I hope so because that's all the Mdm Regt has to give. The "Light" (still 155mm but towed not SPA) Regt is still coming from BRISVEGAS (and in any case doesn't belong to your BDE).

No you had Troops of 2 guns each (and will again) so what you did was right.

With the new vehicle we are going away from 3 Btys per Regt with 6 guns per Bty.

Now you get 3 Btys but each Bty has 3 TPs of two guns each (same number of tubes but more flexible). If you get confused look at the "placeholders" as you will have 6 of them to worry about and each will have a strength of two.

So here you'll have:

Bn's MOR: 8 tubes

2 Btys of Mdm (the third is doing the CAV spt - concurrent task): 12 tubes in 6 TPs

CAS

So that's say 7 fire units (MOR PL as a fire unit) plus the CAS sorties.

Natures: Still no FASCAM and limited DPICM (for use in the paddocks only)

Of course the more guns you want, the more trucks I have to load KT up with to feed them.

Enough toys?

Its nice to know I'm doing it right.

So, same number of guns but more flexible, just how I like it.

(I trust you've added the airstrike "tubes"?)

And I guess if I hit a sheep paddock (and its not too risky), we're having mutton for dinner then?

I thoguht KT liked driving trucks?

**Beep! Beep!** "Outta my way POGs!"

Meh, should keep me busy.

Meh, should keep me busy.

Oh yes you will be.

That Northern peninsula is where the steel works used to be and reminds me of a little town on the West bank of the Volga that ate the German 6th Army a while ago (no tractor works there though).

Oh yes you will be.

That Northern peninsula is where the steel works used to be and reminds me of a little town on the West bank of the Volga that ate the German 6th Army a while ago (no tractor works there though).

Shame SB doesn't model 155mm gunfire. (Stay tuned.)

Ohh! Fireworks!!

I guess 6 Leo2A4s packing only HE on supress orders would be a rough estimate..... but unlikely.

I guess 6 Leo2A4s packing only HE on supress orders would be a rough estimate..... but unlikely.

Yes esp as we don't have any.

Well that's 1000 local.

Off to draw the map.

A bit of an update on the overlay and the ground.

Latest iteration of the trace (missing Spt Coy and the guys holding ground):

Looking back from the FUP.

The A1 Echelon:

Temporary bridge supporting "Route B" improved by some Engr effort by gravelling the banks:

Heavier vehicles need to stick to "Route A".

The FUP itself:

The view looking from the FUP:

A possible intermediate bound:

And some feeds just in, the business end, B Coy's Objective:

C and D Coy's Objective:

Still loking to sort out:

Spt Coy Locations (have MOR PL on map but need Javelin teams)

B Sqn locations (Tk Sqn holding the LD for us, BG TIGER, to conduct a Fwd POL)

Locations for ARH battle positions. May need to gain clearance to use parts of either BG Eagle or BG Pig's TAORs for this (temporary incursion only).

Then of course there's RED to sort out.

Just gotta love all those fences!! :clap: :bigsmile: :luxhello:

Well I'm afraid no Recce this time (that was Mission #1).

As to an outline of tasking etc. read the background brief and orders for Mission #1 and they pretty much set the standard for tasking and pre mission briefing:QUOTE]

My bad. I meant to say, can we determine what we'll be assigned to, or what we can volunteer for, in Mission 2: infantry pl, tank tp, ech, etc? Then I (for one) can do some brushing up if I need to. If this is not feasible, no worries: I'll just try to refresh myself on everything, just in case!