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Scrapper_511

A baker's dozen of NATO vehicles from the mid eighties...

47 posts in this topic

Given the abundance of vehicles already in SB 4.0, it may seem preposterous to wish for yet even more vehicles. However, several NATO vehicles omnipresent around 1985 have been sorely missing from the SB inventory. The throwback vehicles listed below are irrelevant to (present and potential) military customers, but for Cold War aficionados, I think they would be very welcome additions.

 
M2 & M3 Bradley (initial production models)*

M163 Vulcan

AH-1F Cobra (square canopy, M197 Gatling)


Challenger 1

FV-102 Striker

FV-432

FV-433 Abbot

FV-510 Warrior (initial production model)

Westland Lynx

SA 330 Puma


Marder 1A2

Bo 105/PAH-1

 

I understand tweaking existing models can mimic the IFVs I listed here, but for visual authenticity (which strongly lends to immersion), I would strongly prefer the addition of new models altogether.

 

 

* Pretty please with sugar on top

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I can see what you want. And I can see the fun in it.

 

But how do you propose E-sim finance it?

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...and why this is not in the wishlist thread?

 

as for $, € etc etc...I think that only part of the problem. If they got programming time left, much can be done (see: T-72, S'hot etc etc), but the payed for developments must come first.

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Posted (edited)

ressources and time equals money.

 

Those are the basic parameters of any private company.

 

 

and this should be in the wish list

Edited by Nike-Ajax

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On 7/8/2017 at 3:55 AM, Nike-Ajax said:

I can see what you want. And I can see the fun in it.

 

But how do you propose E-sim finance it?

I'm familiar with how eSim is financed and I'm very grateful that, despite insignificant financial profit, PE has been made available to the public and continually updated over the years. I'm merely sharing my personal interest here and I'm ever so hopeful it catches the right eyes. After all, dreams do come true around here.

 

On 7/8/2017 at 4:03 AM, Grenny said:

...and why this is not in the wishlist thread?

 

as for $, € etc etc...I think that only part of the problem. If they got programming time left, much can be done (see: T-72, S'hot etc etc), but the payed for developments must come first.

 

I didn't add this to the wishlist thread because I wanted to gauge and foster interest in a specific era of vehicles. This would've gotten quickly buried by irrelevant posts in the wishlist thread. Besides, the author of that thread requested no more than about five wishes. Even narrowed down, my list has over a dozen vehicles!

 

Thanks for your input, folks. If you want to talk more about the Cold War vehicles I listed here (and others of the same era), that'd be nice too. :)

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Im a big fan of the older vehicles too, and whilst having more variety of kit like the stuff mentioned in the OP would be most welcome,  i personally think that adding more functionality/ crewability to the currently modelled stuff (ie; scorpion/chieftan/pt76/t64/amx13 etc) would be better 'value' and add more depth to multiplayer games. And yes, i have 'wished' this in the relevant thread ;)

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15 hours ago, Bond_Villian said:

Im a big fan of the older vehicles too, and whilst having more variety of kit like the stuff mentioned in the OP would be most welcome,  i personally think that adding more functionality/ crewability to the currently modelled stuff (ie; scorpion/chieftan/pt76/t64/amx13 etc) would be better 'value' and add more depth to multiplayer games. And yes, i have 'wished' this in the relevant thread ;)

 

+1

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On 7/13/2017 at 0:44 PM, Bond_Villian said:

...i personally think that adding more functionality/ crewability to the currently modelled stuff (ie; scorpion/chieftan/pt76/t64/amx13 etc) would be better 'value' and add more depth to multiplayer games.

I hear you, Bond_Villain. It'd be really cool to have "crewable" and fully functional recon, mbt, ifv, and atgm platforms from each nation and I can see how the variety of vehicles would add depth to MP. But I imagine this would be at least as difficult as adding new (non-"crewable") vehicle models, so if there was a choice between these possibilities, however, I'd surely pick new vehicle models over new interior functionality and "crewability" :). I've yet to experience MP so my view may very well be short-sighted.

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13 hours ago, Scrapper_511 said:

I've yet to experience MP so my view may very well be short-sighted

Youre missing out! The weekly TGIF sessions are definately worth checking out

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On 7/25/2017 at 8:58 AM, Bond_Villian said:

Youre missing out! The weekly TGIF sessions are definately worth checking out

I bet! It's just hard to fit into my schedule and what free time I have to play SB I use mostly for map editing. I've checked out a few multiplayer missions (solo play) and they've been pretty neat. Some day soon, though, I hope to join.

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On 28.6.2017 at 1:01 AM, Scrapper_511 said:

Given the abundance of vehicles already in SB 4.0, it may seem preposterous to wish for yet even more vehicles. However, several NATO vehicles omnipresent around 1985 have been sorely missing from the SB inventory. The throwback vehicles listed below are irrelevant to (present and potential) military customers, but for Cold War aficionados, I think they would be very welcome additions.

 
M2 & M3 Bradley (initial production models)*

M163 Vulcan

AH-1F Cobra (square canopy, M197 Gatling)


Challenger 1

FV-102 Striker

FV-432

FV-433 Abbot

FV-510 Warrior (initial production model)

Westland Lynx

SA 330 Puma


Marder 1A2

Bo 105/PAH-1

 

I understand tweaking existing models can mimic the IFVs I listed here, but for visual authenticity (which strongly lends to immersion), I would strongly prefer the addition of new models altogether.

 

 

* Pretty please with sugar on top

There should be a Leopard 2A0-2A3 somewhere in there!

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Posted (edited)

8 hours ago, lavictoireestlavie said:

There should be a Leopard 2A0-2A3 somewhere in there!

You strike a point, lavictoireestlavie! Which variant do you think would be most appropriate for scenarios set from 1980-85? How about for the Bradley, Challenger 1, Marder, and perhaps even the Jaguar?

 

I often refer to the SB Wiki vehicle timeline, but still, it's difficult for me to gauge which given variant would make the best choice for the timeline. Believe it or not, I am trying to minimize the quantity of my hopeful requests (as if doing so would actually help the cause).

Edited by Scrapper_511

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11 hours ago, Scrapper_511 said:

You strike a point, lavictoireestlavie! Which variant do you think would be most appropriate for scenarios set from 1980-85? How about for the Bradley, Challenger 1, Marder, and perhaps even the Jaguar?

 

I often refer to the SB Wiki vehicle timeline, but still, it's difficult for me to gauge which given variant would make the best choice for the timeline. Believe it or not, I am trying to minimize the quantity of my hopeful requests (as if doing so would actually help the cause).

Challenger 1 , Chieftain mk11, Marder 1A2, etc. would definitely be nice additions but we should not forget that an AMX 30B and AMX 30B2 would be nice as well !! 

 

 

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Posted (edited)

On 7/13/2017 at 1:33 PM, Scrapper_511 said:

Besides, the author of that thread requested no more than about five wishes. Even narrowed down, my list has over a dozen vehicles!

 

I didn't expect the thread to endure for so long. I think the initial suggestion of such boundaries are now moot and it being just a wish list is fine.

Edited by Azure Lion

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Posted (edited)

8 hours ago, lavictoireestlavie said:

Challenger 1 , Chieftain mk11, Marder 1A2, etc. would definitely be nice additions but we should not forget that an AMX 30B and AMX 30B2 would be nice as well !! 

 

 

I didn't include French armor because I'm not sure they would make an appearance on a Fulda or Hunfeld map in a mid 1980s scenario.

4 hours ago, Azure Lion said:

 

I didn't expect the thread to endure for so long. I think the initial suggestion of such boundaries are now moot and it being just a wish list is fine.

Thanks, Azure Lion. How does it feel to be the author of the longest running thread around here? ;) You've created a monster!

Edited by Scrapper_511

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On 7/30/2017 at 6:13 PM, Scrapper_511 said:

Thanks, Azure Lion. How does it feel to be the author of the longest running thread around here? ;) You've created a monster!

 

It wasn't my fault, I swear~! Twas the quadriplegic, blind, ninja squirrel that made me do it~! :ph34r:

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So how much do we have to scrape together for a crewable chally 1 and chieftain? 

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I will sacrifice my daughters piggy bank.

 

... and throw real money at a crowdfunding

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Posted (edited)

On 8/9/2017 at 7:04 PM, Major duck said:

crowd funding ?

 

On 8/9/2017 at 6:32 PM, Swordsmandk said:

So how much do we have to scrape together for a crewable chally 1 and chieftain? 

About 3k.  

For a none playable model if memory serves me correctly.

there was a post about how much it costs a while back

But i don't think money would be the issue with esim more.

About time and accurate data.

Edited by Marko

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All of my board games and miniature games for simulating "modern" armored combat were focused on mid 80s orders of battle. GDW in particular had both board games and miniatures rules covering this order of battle very well. As much as I like the idea of eSim supporting such a thing over time... I am already quite satisfied with what they have already provided. But I think I would enjoy a 1960s or 1970s order of battle even more. Imagine facing hordes of T-62s and/or T-64s/T-72s with M60A1s. The years immediately preceding the development/deployment of the M1 were far more challenging for NATO. At the same time, the F-15 was just entering service and the F-16 and F/A-18 were still in development. Cold War gone hot in the 70s is a pretty interesting fight. Israel in 1973 was a preview of what Germany might have looked like... Ultimately a NATO win, but at great cost.

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23 hours ago, Marko said:

About 3k.

So purchasing 3000 Steel Beasts mugs per desired vehicle should cover the cost. Place your orders folks! I believe I've done my share (four mugs) for one single track pin.

18 hours ago, streakeagle said:

But I think I would enjoy a 1960s or 1970s order of battle even more. Imagine facing hordes of T-62s and/or T-64s/T-72s with M60A1s.

WP inventory already there. M60A1 and you're golden for US.

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On 11/08/2017 at 11:22 AM, streakeagle said:

Imagine facing hordes of T-62s and/or T-64s/T-72s with M60A1s

You can pretty much do that in the current SB version.

 

 

 

Heres a very neat list of whats in there now (courtesy of Rotar) ;

 

On 10/08/2017 at 2:13 AM, Rotareneg said:

Here is an image of the list of vehicles (from 4.006, I think it's still current.) Light grey vehicles don't have crewable positions.

nUG37y5.png

Edited Thursday at 02:15 AM by Rotareneg

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Well, there is no M60A1. Arguably you could substitute it by an M60A3 with thermal imager and stabilization damage, but it's not actually an A1 version; similar options you'd have with the Leopard 1. Also, the available munitions would be a but dubious/anachronistic for a 1960s scenario; APFSDS really took off only from the early 1970s on.

 

If you can look past that, I suppose everything's in place. Of course, nobody would reject the addition of a playable BMP-1, or the FV432 based vehicle family, or other 1970s playable British tanks, or the AMX-30. But, well, that's the thing with wish lists. There's always one more thing that would be nice to see added.

 

 

Well, for eSim Games it's one vehicle at a time. And we need to keep in mind the overall simulation capability. I'm always in favor of adding features that leave everything that's already there completely untouched, but which add an entirely new dimension to the depth and width of what we're doing.

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