PincerDK

Hmmm... Will see into it and update if I find somerhing... Sounds like another scoring bug.

Roger, otherwise good scenario, lots of variables and yet quite simple.

Exactly, since Harpoon Classic is not updated anymore AFAIK, i'm hoping to do some Cold War Scenarios when CNAO comes out.

It does look a bit complicated though. :cool:

New stuff from the naval sim.

http://www.warfaresims.com/

Looks like they are talking of a v1 release soon.

Hi Zipuli

I just tried the scenario with the Leopard 2A4 platoon.

I destroyed most the enemy counterattack and only serious tank casualty was my driver but the mission still ended before the time was up and i received a 20 out of 100 resulting in an incomplete mission.

Is this correct?

Unfortunately I don't have the AAR.

You need to now think about who replaces you.

Ehmmm....Tjay again?

Connection shouldn't be a problem for me.

But in case it happens, I'll appoint a new one from the company/battalion.

Great, but that's an internal arrangement.

I'm not sending 3 x PMs out on the off chance one of you is doing it this week.

I'm sending one PM to the designated XO (and that's Marko until Tjay tells me otherwise).

Agreed, this was more just in case Marko dropped out of the session and Tjay needed an XO. And not an excuse just to receive the PM. Planning is of course up to you guys.

Marko has accepted the role of xo.

And just in case he's not available nor is Hedge, I will happily be XO for Brit Force.

While the arty thundered in the background and reports from fleeing citizens of russian tanks in the village behind the hills the unit was out of contact with higher ups. So CO decided to send a dispatch rider on a MC back, afraid that the net was being jammed by russian electronic warfare units.

When the dispatch rider returned to the CO the CO asked, almost red in the face:

-"So, what is happening? why havent we received any orders!? why havent we recieved any reports regarding the rumoured tanks in the village?"

Dispatch Rider just shrugged his shoulders, mumbling something like

-"Damn if I know, its a nuthouse over there, two officers at eachothers throats about some radio net setup and procedure, when I tried to interfere they told me to go to hell, so here I am again. If you want me Im over at the mess trying to get some coffee going."

lol.

...and everyone else in Europe for that matter

Yes, we deserve some attention too. :biggrin:

I agree, T-64A/B and some of them T-64BV were mostly on the frontline units. T-72B more on second-line along with T-72A. Some T-55AM on the frontlines, but most were part of third line formations.

And again, my plan was to participate and again, it didn't happen.

Ellers super fin kvalitet! :thumbup:

Yes to all. Limited objectives will be something that would typically be an objective in a TGIF scenario, something that won't be easy to accomplish, but it shouldn't be impossible either. In most cases both sides may have the exact same objective (traditional) such as hold/capture a specific spot on the terrain, but in other cases they might have different objectives entirely -- neither side will fully know until the end.

Recon battles are somewhat similar with their objectives, something difficult but not impossible to accomplish, although if one side is doing particularly bad then they might get a slight nod in their recon objective for that week as a sort of natural balancing factor of sorts. As for the recon battle units, they will consist of reconnaissance type forces/units which may or may not be the same units in the TOE of the line units. OPFOR will consist of their doctrinal forward elements such as the CRP, FP, and FSE -- so they will be quite uniform, but blue will consist of a mixture of reconnaissance type units that may vary. In most cases BLUEFOR recon units will consist of things like HMMWVs, M3 Bradleys, and in some cases M1 tanks (for US Cav), ASLAV-25 for SpPz Luchs and Leopard 1 or 2, and whatever we decide to represent British Scimitars, what-nots and so-forths. :biggrin:

Cool, And you will decide which, what and where it is?

Awesome, hmm yes the Pizarro is already taken as stand-in and is a little too powerful. Maybe just go with ASLAV-25s for Brits also?

Just read through the Red Tide rules, and I was wondering what could a limited objective be? Seize this particular terrain, defend this area longer than XX.XX minutes? Something like that?

And regarding the Recon battle, is it dedicated reconnaissance units for BLUFOR or just tank and mech platoons taken from the companies?

Otherwise keep it up Volcano, this looks to be a lot of fun! :biggrin:

Put me under UK-Battalion, no particular preference but either 1 COY, 3 SQN or 4 COY.

Just put me on something shiny! :bigsmile:

Sounds interesting! If time permits, count me in. :cool:

Actually I think they were focused on a much more realistic approach than ArmA 2 with weakpoints and different armour strengths depending on where and which tank.

But yeah, it doesn't look that convincing to me either, compared to what you see in Steel Beasts.

Still +1 for effort!

They way they did in Red Orchestra 2 seems more realistic, despite it being much more infantry-focused than tank.

What isn't modeled yet is the PZB200 image intensifier that the Canadians had but which doesn't seem to be part of the Leo AS1.

In addition to the LLLTV, the late 80s C1 received the IRS100 thermal system: http://articles.janes.com/articles/J...t-Germany.html

http://www.kotsch88.de/f_pzb200.htm

I would presume this is the one. It does look a bit like the T-72's night sight, although far better quality.

Does image intensifier qualify as TIS or as part of a IR-search light combination?

Actually now that we are talking about stuff that is on a Leopard 1, other than this one, what is the purpose of the big box, to the left of the Leopard 1 turret?

Yes, there were many more components of the recce squadron: SHQ, troops, A1 Echelon, A2 Echelon and so forth. I was just addressing your query regarding Lynx numbers and employment. The Sqn 2/IC was employed primarily in the Sqn A2 Echelon dealing with resupply and admin. As required (Sqn Comd became a casualty, for example) the 2/IC came forward, got an update brief from the Battle Captain, and continued with the Squadron operational tasks. He always monitored the sqn ops net to keep up to date, so slipping in to the Sqn Comd role was not overly difficult.

If A2 is admin/resupply, does A1 Echelon correspond to a reserve force?

Of course that makes sense.

The battle captain (which I first stumbled upon in "First Clash", is he an commissioned officer or senior enlisted?)

In my time (early '80's) we used the Cougar primarily as a tank trainer, and the sqn was configured along the lines of a tank sqn. Subsequently the Cougar was used briefly on ops in Bosnia (mid-1990's), but it was not used as a recce vehicle, IIRC.

It does seem like a vehicle that never actually had a real purpose?

This was my Cougar in 1983:

That is one beauty I must say!

The formation of a div recce regt was floated at some time in the '80's (again, IIRC), but it did not get too far. Primarily, the concept for us was: armd recce sqn acted as bde recce, inf recce pls provided close recce for their respective battalions, remaining bde units were responsible for their own security and recce parties. The recce parties, BTW, were formed to assist in unit moves in conjunction with bde operations. So, if necessary, they'd form, do their recce, assist the unit to make the move, then dissolve back into their "real" jobs within the unit.

A divisional recce regiment, maybe like the british recce regiment? Could have been interesting how that one would turn out.

And the Lynx is just an M113 with some small changes right?

Thank you very much for your input Tango29, interesting to hear how you Canadians operate.

We did used the Cougar later in the 90's after the regular force stopped using them. For a number of years we did all kinds of armoured ops in them, even some COIN.

Being a fast, dependable (after retro-fit and removed from the reg force) and quiet (compared to tracks) they did well in the recce role. The only down side we found was having no dismounts. When the Coyote entered service they fixed the dismount issue, however as we found out in Afstgn, the 25mm was no match for the mud walls, hence the Leo1C1 deployment.

The 76mm in the Cougar would have done the same effect with HESH on the mud walls, but they had been withdrawn from service by then.

That's a shame, combining 76mm HESH and quiet tracks could have been useful in COIN operations, especially in A-stan.

I have read somewhere that the 5th CMBG (French) in 1989 had a regiment of Cougars? the 12e Rgt Blinde du Can? Can anyone confirm this?

1. Depends. It could be either shoulder launched or mounted on a tripod which was able to hold three missiles.

3. Sure.

4. The C-7 (M-16) started replacing the FN in the mid-80's. Usually there were 2 M72's in a section, but that doesn't mean they didn't carry more or less depending on what thier mission was. The Carl-G was part of a heavy weapons detachment within the platoon, which also included a C-6 (7.62mm GPMG) and a 60mm motar.

1. Well three would of course increase the odds but I think the british thought it was lacking during the Falklands War.

3. But I mean, does the C1 have any limitations or advantages? IIRC the Leopard 1A3 did not have TIS for example.

4. And it is 8 people per section?

Anyway thanks Tacbat.

IIRC correctly, the Recce squadron had 24 Lynx divided into three troops and a Squadron HQ (plus other vehicles in the SHQ and the echelons). Each troop had one Lynx for the Tp Ldr and three patrols of two Lynx each = 7 Lynx per troop. Three troops = 21 Lynx. SHQ had one Lynx for each of the Squadron Commander, Battle Captain and Liaison Officer ( a necessary and very important position as, on ops, the squadron was cut to the Brigade Commader as his brigade recce force. The LO was dealing directly with the Brigade staff on behalf of the Squadron Commander).

This is how our recce squadron was organized, but that was a few years before the timeframe you provide. I don't think that there was too much variance, but there may have been some. This, at least, will give you a good starting point!

There's no 2IC for the recon squadron?

No i don't think either there would be that big of a difference.

What about the Cougar? was it used as a recon vehicle?

And do you know if there were any divisional recon units? Or was it only brigade recon squadron and each infantry battalion's recon squadron?

Thanks for the information Tango, the structure does seems fair for a reconnaissance unit.

Thank you Jartsev.

Hello guys!

I have a couple of short questions regarding Canadian Order Of Battle during 1989ish?

1. What were there of Air Defense systems? ADATS was that fielded yet in large numbers? Blowpipe was still quite relevant, but how effective was it? EDIT: Just read that ADATS were only fielded in larger numbers after the Cold War and Javelin were starting to replace the blowpipe.

2. How were the the tank regiment's recon squadron organized? 20 lynx divided up into 4 vehicle platoon's and further divided into 2 vehicle sections?

3. Would the Leopard 1A5 be a suitable proxy for a Leopard C1?

4. How was a infantry section organised? 8 persons equipped with FN FAL and M72 LAWs?? Was the Carl Gustav part of a separate weapons platoon?

Hope anyone can answer these questions.

Esben.

that is pretty cool. :shocked:

Aaaargh!!! Looks like someone had a lot of silver paint

Hmmm, what would the original colours had been?

Goddamn that's impressive.

No problem, I have already port forwarded when I attended TGIF.

So if it works for TGIF, it would probably also work for tonight.

Looks very interesting. :shocked:

Excellent Pincer. I look forward to it.

Me too.

UK Armour has room for a two more, and I'd be happy to meet you on Teamspeak any evening from 1900Z (200BST) onwards this week. Or you could drop into our next Sunday evening session at the same time. Best to arrive about 15 min early for a chat.

Cool sounds good, I would probably drop in on Sunday. About ½ hour before then.

Mark Gibson is our TDY Senior Training Officer and continues to be invaluable. Another of our assets is the imitable Hedgehog.

Yes saw them both in action in the Brave Rifles Campaign, looks like they know what they are doing. That was also a superb campaign.

But I will meet up with you guys on sunday at 1900 zulu/GMT time. Right?