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TGIF 2016: scenario list, discussion, and house rules

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Well sure but staying in the open meant being shot up by the ATGMs (which have better concealment now).

 

More than once I heard one Company commander try to give a good indication as to where an ATGM was (the Company on the left side of the valley was trying to support the Company on the right), while the other vehicles in the Company he had left unattended were being hit by arty. Arguable they may have survived better if given defend commands, etc. but I suspect they forgot to give those.

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1 hour ago, Gibsonm said:

Arguable they may have survived better if given defend commands, etc. but I suspect they forgot to give those.

I think this is part of a bigger issue, where players are handling too many vehicles. 

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1 hour ago, Gibsonm said:

Well sure but staying in the open meant being shot up by the ATGMs (which have better concealment now).

 

More than once I heard one Company commander try to give a good indication as to where an ATGM was (the Company on the left side of the valley was trying to support the Company on the right), while the other vehicles in the Company he had left unattended were being hit by arty. Arguable they may have survived better if given defend commands, etc. but I suspect they forgot to give those.

 

Gib, I would love to experience your command style. 

 

Would you please have a go at it when you're up for it.

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Well come to any of the last Rolling Thunder missions, or attend the Red Tide Campaign

 

4 missions per session, over the last 5 or so years.

 

Or attend the Red Tide Campaign.

 

I do enough CO'ing in real life. TGIF is meant to be relaxing for me.

 

Also I wasn't saying that the CO or any of the Company Commanders on Blue performed poorly - I was just outlining some of the challenges they faced.

 

Perhaps it might just be worth changing:

 

7 hours ago, ashdivay said:

Good show Red CO. Good game everyone else. Games like these make TGIF the best SB MP event. 

 

Which implies that everyone had a great time, to just saying Red had a good experience?

 

Edited by Gibsonm

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Well, both sides are guilty of it: only the winning side has fun in TGIF, it's a classic SB/TGIF (actually, gaming in general) problem. Just look at TGIF two weeks ago when the shoe was on the other foot. ;)

 

In general...

 

I wouldn't characterize TGIF as a frustration free or relaxing time, its essentially a competitive game we play once a week where we are all intentionally challenged, but in a way that can be limited by the participant in the quantity and types of units chosen for ownership. The best way to reduce frustration and relax is to reduce the number of units controlled, and possibly control supporting units (like recon, support, artillery, etc). I find it a huge difference from CO'ing a side to playing a single platoon which I find nice, from time to time.

 

That said, none of these scenarios can be considered "perfect" either, but we do have to:

 

a) Separate the act of "winning" from "having fun".

b) Look first at the fault being with the plan and execution before assuming it is an issue with the scenario, and discuss ways in which to improve for next time. If nothing else, it is respectful to the scenario designer who did the work.

c) Look at, and mention, our own faults during a mission before pointing out faults in others.

d) Provide constructive criticism on how to improve the scenario AFTER admitting faults in the plan and execution.

 

In all cases it should should be a shared responsibility (blame), in most cases at least, unless the scenario was totally broken.

 

If we can do all of the above, then the TGIF experience would be a lot better for those who might be experiencing frustration. I guess the most common issue in a TGIF game is that there might not be enough participants per side though.

 

edit:

 

The other thing I have to mention, is that many of the TGIF "issues" are caused by a CO that determines that a mission cannot be won at all, or unless they do X,Y or Z, often a course of action that either over complicates the situation or, at the very least, restricts the amount of "fun" the participants will have.

 

Besides the scenario designer, the COs are who directly determine what the TGIF experience will be, and the intent of TGIF is not to figure out which CO wins more than others - the number of times a particular CO wins is irrelevant to the experience as a whole. In other words, if you think a situation is impossible, then don't CO, and if you are a CO then your intent should be about coming up with a good basic plan that puts as many people into the action as possible, trusts your subordinates, and gives a "good fight".

 

Just food for thought...

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2 DEC scenario:

 

Symmetrical Attack 11-SC-4010-OMUx

 

For inquiring minds: why the "x" in the name? Its a temporary version to avoid an issue with time delay repairs. Vehicle repairs will not have a time delay (until its fixed in the next update). :D

 

SPECIAL CONSIDERATIONS:

  • There will be a draft.

 

NOTES:

  • Avoid studying the enemy's side; only gather intel from the briefing and exposed enemy unit icons (enemy intel), and briefly looking over both sides to figure out which one you want to CO. Anything beyond that ruins the fog of war element.
  • To avoid passwords, open the scenario in Network Session as HOST and choose the side you want to play and go to planning phase. You may briefly look at both sides like this to see which side you want to play or CO on. As CO, once you choose a side, go to that side and create your plan.
  • Remember to play within the TGIF House Rules and SB.com community rules.

 

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On 11/28/2016 at 6:16 PM, Volcano said:

I guess the most common issue in a TGIF game is that there might not be enough participants per side though.

 

That's one way of putting it.  Another way would be that the missions are consistently too large for typical attendance levels. :) 

 

Perhaps it makes sense to conduct a poll to get a more concrete understanding of the community's preferences in this regard, and tailor the mission pool accordingly?

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Well, we only have so many "good" and complete missions.  If the community wants smaller missions then they can dig down and make some and we can see about working them in the rotation. :)

 

 

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9 DEC scenario:

 

Iranistan-Iraqistan War (1980)-4010a-MAD

 

For inquiring minds: why the "MAD" in the name? Manual Azimuth Determination.

 

SPECIAL CONSIDERATIONS:

  • There will NOT be a draft.

 

NOTES:

  • Avoid studying the enemy's side; only gather intel from the briefing and exposed enemy unit icons (enemy intel), and briefly looking over both sides to figure out which one you want to CO. Anything beyond that ruins the fog of war element.
  • To avoid passwords, open the scenario in Network Session as HOST and choose the side you want to play and go to planning phase. You may briefly look at both sides like this to see which side you want to play or CO on. As CO, once you choose a side, go to that side and create your plan.
  • Remember to play within the TGIF House Rules and SB.com community rules.

 

 

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10 minutes ago, Volcano said:
For inquiring minds: why the "MAD" in the name? Manual Azimuth Determination.

 

Not Mutually Assured Destruction, where both sides have a trigger that kills everyone on both sides? :D

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On 11/28/2016 at 6:16 PM, Volcano said:

Well, both sides are guilty of it: only the winning side has fun in TGIF, it's a classic SB/TGIF (actually, gaming in general) problem. Just look at TGIF two weeks ago when the shoe was on the other foot. ;)

 

In general...

 

I wouldn't characterize TGIF as a frustration free or relaxing time, its essentially a competitive game we play once a week where we are all intentionally challenged, but in a way that can be limited by the participant in the quantity and types of units chosen for ownership. The best way to reduce frustration and relax is to reduce the number of units controlled, and possibly control supporting units (like recon, support, artillery, etc). I find it a huge difference from CO'ing a side to playing a single platoon which I find nice, from time to time.

 

That said, none of these scenarios can be considered "perfect" either, but we do have to:

 

a) Separate the act of "winning" from "having fun".

b) Look first at the fault being with the plan and execution before assuming it is an issue with the scenario, and discuss ways in which to improve for next time. If nothing else, it is respectful to the scenario designer who did the work.

c) Look at, and mention, our own faults during a mission before pointing out faults in others.

d) Provide constructive criticism on how to improve the scenario AFTER admitting faults in the plan and execution.

 

In all cases it should should be a shared responsibility (blame), in most cases at least, unless the scenario was totally broken.

 

If we can do all of the above, then the TGIF experience would be a lot better for those who might be experiencing frustration. I guess the most common issue in a TGIF game is that there might not be enough participants per side though.

 

edit:

 

The other thing I have to mention, is that many of the TGIF "issues" are caused by a CO that determines that a mission cannot be won at all, or unless they do X,Y or Z, often a course of action that either over complicates the situation or, at the very least, restricts the amount of "fun" the participants will have.

 

Besides the scenario designer, the COs are who directly determine what the TGIF experience will be, and the intent of TGIF is not to figure out which CO wins more than others - the number of times a particular CO wins is irrelevant to the experience as a whole. In other words, if you think a situation is impossible, then don't CO, and if you are a CO then your intent should be about coming up with a good basic plan that puts as many people into the action as possible, trusts your subordinates, and gives a "good fight".

 

Just food for thought...

 

 

13 Years later, and the same Bickering of "the scene is Impossible" remains. .  If Not a Co relax, and follow orders.   No one has made more Mistakes than Me.  Many a person under My command has been lead into DOOM, or received a sabot of Mine up their arse because Of My mistakes, Volcano can attest to that.  I learned long ago to accept it for what it is.   A Good Co will accept the outcome of His team.  If You are a Co, prepare, lay it on the line, and accept Your fate for Your decisions, victory or defeat. Learn from Your mistakes, and move on.  Sometimes Your the Hammer, Sometimes Your the anvil.

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I take Red in the Ira-bowl, and help decide who is the Ira-est of them all.

Edited by TankHunter

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16 DEC scenario:

 

Hasty Defense 01 (DE) Leo1A4-HTH-4010a

 

This scenario might be quick; if it is we can all decide if we want to run a co-op.

 

SPECIAL CONSIDERATIONS:

  • There will NOT be a draft.

 

NOTES:

  • Avoid studying the enemy's side; only gather intel from the briefing and exposed enemy unit icons (enemy intel), and briefly looking over both sides to figure out which one you want to CO. Anything beyond that ruins the fog of war element.
  • To avoid passwords, open the scenario in Network Session as HOST and choose the side you want to play and go to planning phase. You may briefly look at both sides like this to see which side you want to play or CO on. As CO, once you choose a side, go to that side and create your plan.
  • Remember to play within the TGIF House Rules and SB.com community rules.

 

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23 DEC scenario:

 

1973 Sinai Operation scn01-H2H and...

     {1973 Sinai Operation scn02-H2H or 1973 Sinai Operation scn03-H2H}

 

We are going to try something new -- we will run through the 1973 Sinai Operation in head to head mode as a sort of community mini-campaign of sorts.

 

The idea is we start it this TGIF and play through to completion, two scenarios per TGIF (except for the longer scenarios, then it will just be one per TGIF). Depending on how it plays out, it should probably be completed by three TGIFs or so.

 

This week we will start with scn01 and, depending on who wins, we will play EITHER scn02 OR scn03 right afterwards (back to back with planning phase). All three are short scenarios.

 

 

SPECIAL CONSIDERATIONS:

  • There will NOT be a draft.
  • Whatever side you take at the start, then you need to remain on that side for the duration of the campaign, DO NOT SWITCH SIDES. Choose your side wisely.
  • Planning Phase (for both missions) will be timed, 30 minutes maximum then we start.
  • The CO does NOT have to be the same in every scenario. Whoever wants to do it can do it, mission by mission. If someone wants to CO every mission then that is fine too.

NOTES:

  • Avoid studying the enemy's side; only gather intel from the briefing and exposed enemy unit icons (enemy intel), and briefly looking over both sides to figure out which one you want to CO. Anything beyond that ruins the fog of war element.
  • To avoid passwords, open the scenario in Network Session as HOST and choose the side you want to play and go to planning phase. You may briefly look at both sides like this to see which side you want to play or CO on. As CO, once you choose a side, go to that side and create your plan.
  • Remember to play within the TGIF House Rules and SB.com community rules.

 

 

 

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5 minutes ago, TSe419E said:

I will not be able to attend this TGIF.  Will be at my mom's house for Christmas.

 

Reschedule it! Just kidding, have fun. :)

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Red briefing appears to be missing some notes regarding disposition of units and spawn/arrival conditions. Also, Manual Azimuth Determination? Yuk! ;)

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