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Some observations/questions.


ChrisWerb
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First of all a big thank you to the developers, contributors and especially those who spent so much time putting together the wonderful instructional/training material for SB.  It's a sad admission, but I can't remember when I had this much fun. SB is fast proving to be the best $125 I ever spent. I'm still having a few issues though. Clearly I am probably doing things wrong in most instances, but I would like some input.

 

1. Am I right in thinking that Red team vehicles get to shoot with full accuracy as if in daylight despite it being a moonless night?  If so, why is their driving affected, but not their gunnery?  T-72s etc. definitely seem slower at night.  I know there is a workaround in that you can set a maximum engagement distance, but you can only do that per unit. It would be great if you could set that for an entire category of vehicle/troops with one radio button in mission editor.

 

2. Whilst I am delighted at the intelligence shown by M1IP and Leo1A5 commanders in choosing hull down fighting positions and generally reacting intelligently to emerging threats, my M901s tend to either sit right out in the open or position themselves behind a tree that blocks their view. I also had one pull up and park right in front of my tank which was in a hull down position. This is weird for a vehicle specifically designed to utilise hull-down positions. Do "other" vehicles get less intelligent AI by default?

 

3. I have had quite a few instances where loss of stabilization meant initially not being able to load the gun in the M1A2 despite the loader still being alive. Frantic pressing of the Emergency fire mode buttons overcame this, but why would loss of stab temporarily inhibit loading - is it that the gun is stuck in too high an elevation?

 

4. Have had quite a few occasions - albeit on the instant action scenario only as I haven't tried the vehicle in a scenario of my own making - where the M1A2 loader continues to load HEAT despite the Commander audibly calling for Sabot. I have not had this happen on any other vehicle. It can be a brown trouser moment when you have a late model T72 closing in on you and you keep hitting him with what are essentially spitballs. :)

 

5. Again quite a few situations where M1IP and Leo1A5 that had shot out one type of ammo and were not currently engaged, sit there as if they had completely run out and needed manual intervention to get them to reload their ready racks - I thought this would be basic AI behaviour? Does it need to be enabled somehow?

 

6. Several times I have been referred to a drop down menu to enable me to reload missiles etc. This is the screen I have - I don't see any dropdown menus.

 

SBscreen.jpg
windows 7 screen shot

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by ChrisWerb
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PS: How do I prevent crew-served weapon teams from hiding in buildings from which they cannot use their main weapon? Whether or not given an engage order, my 0.50 cal team disassembles its weapon and makes a dash for the nearest building where it then sits out the engagement.  

 

Ditto in a scenario in Finland, an HMG unit appeared (using view to check) well away from water when still in setup mode. During the game it immediately appeared either in the water at the water's edge or actively wading out into the water.

Edited by ChrisWerb
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From the view in your screenshot right click on the symbol of your vehicle in the lower right corner to select reload.

 

Or move your cursor to the top of the screen to get the drop-down menus to appear.  The reload function is listed under the Vehicle menu.

 

 

SS_13_16_08.jpg

Edited by TSe419E
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8 hours ago, ChrisWerb said:

1. Am I right in thinking that Red team vehicles get to shoot with full accuracy as if in daylight despite it being a moonless night?  If so, why is their driving affected, but not their gunnery?  T-72s etc. definitely seem slower at night.  I know there is a workaround in that you can set a maximum engagement distance, but you can only do that per unit. It would be great if you could set that for an entire category of vehicle/troops with one radio button in mission editor.

 

I haven't done much night fighting, however I seem to definitely recall feeling like the reds with IR sights opened fire at shorter ranges.

 

8 hours ago, ChrisWerb said:

2. Whilst I am delighted at the intelligence shown by M1IP and Leo1A5 commanders in choosing hull down fighting positions and generally reacting intelligently to emerging threats, my M901s tend to either sit right out in the open or position themselves behind a tree that blocks their view. I also had one pull up and park right in front of my tank which was in a hull down position. This is weird for a vehicle specifically designed to utilise hull-down positions. Do "other" vehicles get less intelligent AI by default?

 

They may have limits on what kind of slope they can be on and still use their launcher.  Recall the bubble sights in the M2/M3 Bradley series.

8 hours ago, ChrisWerb said:

3. I have had quite a few instances where loss of stabilization meant initially not being able to load the gun in the M1A2 despite the loader still being alive. Frantic pressing of the Emergency fire mode buttons overcame this, but why would loss of stab temporarily inhibit loading - is it that the gun is stuck in too high an elevation?

 

The gun is not stuck in too high an elevation for loading.  You've either found a bug, or you're not understanding what's going on.  Try to recreate this under controlled conditions.

8 hours ago, ChrisWerb said:

4. Have had quite a few occasions - albeit on the instant action scenario only as I haven't tried the vehicle in a scenario of my own making - where the M1A2 loader continues to load HEAT despite the Commander audibly calling for Sabot. I have not had this happen on any other vehicle. It can be a brown trouser moment when you have a late model T72 closing in on you and you keep hitting him with what are essentially spitballs. :)

 

The command "FIRE FIRE SABOT!" is a command to start loading Sabots.  If the gun is empty and the loader is in the process of being loaded, he may have already progressed sufficiently far enough into loading HEAT that he will load HEAT until the next loading cycle.  Essentially, if he has already pulled a HEAT from the rack he's going to load it, and I have had this happen in many vehicles on occasion.

 

There's only a bug here if he loads two or more HEATs after the command to switch to Sabot.

9 hours ago, ChrisWerb said:

5. Again quite a few situations where M1IP and Leo1A5 that had shot out one type of ammo and were not currently engaged, sit there as if they had completely run out and needed manual intervention to get them to reload their ready racks - I thought this would be basic AI behaviour? Does it need to be enabled somehow?

 

The AI will reload on it's own, but only under certain circumstances.  I'm pretty sure if they were in a safe place they would eventually decide to reload.

You can still order them to top off manually.

 

1 hour ago, Gibsonm said:

Amazing what a bit of RTFM / tutorials will do.

 

What I'm going to say at this point...Is, basically...Chris, I'll be pretty blunt here, you're asking lots of "noob questions"...

I had to learn everything you have to learn, and I'm still learning.  Take some more time to read the manuals, and make small simple scenarios to experiment with things, before immediately asking here.

 

For example...

 

6 hours ago, TSe419E said:

From the view in your screenshot right click on the symbol of your vehicle in the lower right corner to select reload.

 

I provided this same information on Tuesday:

 

 

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10 minutes ago, Maj.Hans said:

 

I haven't done much night fighting, however I seem to definitely recall feeling like the reds with IR sights opened fire at shorter ranges.

 

 

They may have limits on what kind of slope they can be on and still use their launcher.  Recall the bubble sights in the M2/M3 Bradley series.

 

The gun is not stuck in too high an elevation for loading.  You've either found a bug, or you're not understanding what's going on.  Try to recreate this under controlled conditions.

 

The command "FIRE FIRE SABOT!" is a command to start loading Sabots.  If the gun is empty and the loader is in the process of being loaded, he may have already progressed sufficiently far enough into loading HEAT that he will load HEAT until the next loading cycle.  Essentially, if he has already pulled a HEAT from the rack he's going to load it, and I have had this happen in many vehicles on occasion.

 

There's only a bug here if he loads two or more HEATs after the command to switch to Sabot.

 

The AI will reload on it's own, but only under certain circumstances.  I'm pretty sure if they were in a safe place they would eventually decide to reload.

You can still order them to top off manually.

 

 

What I'm going to say at this point...Is, basically...Chris, I'll be pretty blunt here, you're asking lots of "noob questions"...

I had to learn everything you have to learn, and I'm still learning.  Take some more time to read the manuals, and make small simple scenarios to experiment with things, before immediately asking here.

 

For example...

Or join a VU.

Taking the step of joining a VU is probably the best thing a newbie can do after reading the starter guide.  .

 

 

I have been playing SB for over ten years and I am still learning all the time

Have read the manual cover to cover a few times.

but its about eight years old, could use buying an updated one when it becomes available

We used to have a saying in UK armour there is no such thing as a silly question.

I think for a sim like SB that's a valid comment the mechanics of playing the game are not that difficult to learn.

But it does take time.

I stopped playing SB for awhile due to RL commitments and was surprised when I started playing again just how much i had forgotten in a relatively short time but that's what keeps my interest in the sim fresh well that and the updates.  

10 minutes ago, Maj.Hans said:

 

 

I provided this same information on Tuesday:

 

 

 

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Thank you Hans. I may be a noob, but I'm not suffering from Pre senile dementia. You provided the information, but I couldn't see the menu you were referring to. it only pops up if you move your mouse to the top of the screen, which a later poster kindly pointed out.

 

I will try and replicate the persistent heat loading glitch. I have played quite a lot of instant action sessions with various Leos, M1s and the Chally 2 and it only happens with the M1A2.

 

Marko, thank you. I want to be competent with several vehicles before joining a Vu*  and really appreciate all the help you are providing me. 

 

*Assuming one will have me...

Edited by ChrisWerb
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10 hours ago, ChrisWerb said:

1. Am I right in thinking that Red team vehicles get to shoot with full accuracy as if in daylight despite it being a moonless night?  If so, why is their driving affected, but not their gunnery?  

I know there is a workaround in that you can set a maximum engagement distance, but you can only do that per unit.

 

a) Yes and No. Units are limited in their ability to spot target, but once that the enemy shoots, their muzzle fire is the beacon to aim for it until the firing units manages to break line of sight. This still is more of a hack than an actual night combat simulation, admittedly. But still probably better than nothing. Officially Steel Beasts does NOT simulate night combat.

 

b) Your workaround doesn't work. The maximum engagement distance is actually the line to open fire. Once that the condition is fulfilled, units (that have been spotted) at ANY range are fair game. Also, if a unit comes under fire it will return fire, not only to the attacking unit but anyone who is deemed hostile.

 

Also, I cannot stress often enough how important knowledge of Chapter 8 of the user's manual is. These are the basic rules by which computer-controlled units behave.

 

 

Quote

2. Whilst I am delighted at the intelligence shown by M1IP and Leo1A5 commanders in choosing hull down fighting positions and generally reacting intelligently to emerging threats, my M901s tend to either sit right out in the open ... This is weird for a vehicle specifically designed to utilise hull-down positions. Do "other" vehicles get less intelligent AI by default?

 

No. You may have discovered a bug.

There is no intentional discrimination between unit types as to how intelligent or stupid they are.

 

 

Quote

3. I have had quite a few instances where loss of stabilization meant initially not being able to load the gun in the M1A2 despite the loader still being alive. ... why would loss of stab temporarily inhibit loading...?

 

Again, you may have discovered a bug, or an incomplete implementation.

That said, you could rationalize it by assuming that a loss of stabilization would (in real life) often result in erratic turret movement; something that is still on The List of things to do, one day, time permitting. So, while the turret would not appear to be under control the crew might have other things on their mind than loading the gun; the obvious issue being that the erratic movement is not visualized - other than a blinking damage list line.

 

 

Quote

5. Again quite a few situations where M1IP and Leo1A5 that had shot out one type of ammo and were not currently engaged, sit there as if they had completely run out and needed manual intervention to get them to reload their ready racks - I thought this would be basic AI behaviour? Does it need to be enabled somehow?

 

In order to initiate a reload a unit must not be under fire (particularly not if the turret would need to get rotated into a vulnerable position. As the platoon leader (at least in Leopard units) ammo management is your responsibility. Others already showed the menus by which the commands can be issued. The key however is to pull a tank into cover (if possible) before issuing the reload command while the rest of the platoon provides cover by fire, and overwatch.

With the generally more painful reload procedure of the M1, I could imagine that the standard procedure would be to manage ammo at the company level, by pulling out a whole platoon for relaod rather than doing quick reloads in short battle pauses like you can (and should) do with the Leos.

If I remember it correctly, US tank units would typically try and refill the read rack straight from an ammo dump rather than transferring from the semi-ready to ready rack. Provided that the circumstances allow for it, of course.

 

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Thank you Nils. I was unaware of the slower reloading on the M1 series (relative to Leo 2) until I discovered it in the game and I assumed there might be some difference in stowage arrangements or ergonomics in general that prevented it. There are so many things I run into in SB that have me thinking "Wow! That's clever!" or "So THAT'S how they do this in real life".

 

I'm taking a break from SB.com for a while, some of which I'll spend learning the manual to a Koranic level of memorisation. When I get back I'll be bugging folk about potential VU probationary membership. Thank you for all your help guys - it's been greatly appreciated. 

Edited by ChrisWerb
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1 hour ago, ChrisWerb said:

Thank you Hans. I may be a noob, but I'm not suffering from Pre senile dementia. You provided the information, but I couldn't see the menu you were referring to. it only pops up if you move your mouse to the top of the screen, which a later poster kindly pointed out.

 

Actually, that's not the one I was referring to...

 

Near the bottom right of your screen you'll see unit markers/symbols representing your current vehicle/squad/platoon/etc.

 

You can use those to give commands to reload or stop reloading, commands for your current unit to swap out hot MG barrels, etc.

Try clicking on them with your various mouse buttons and see what happens.

Edited by Maj.Hans
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