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Chiquito

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Posted (edited)

One of the NO NO I find in the Sim is the must to concert a meet to make a Multiplayer play. I hate that.

 

I hope they build a free open Multiplayer mode to play online anytime I want with players. 

 

Dont tell this is a different kind of game because for me that sound bs.

Edited by Chiquito

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1 hour ago, Chiquito said:

One of the NO NO I find in the Sim is the must to concert a meet to make a Multiplayer play. I hate that.

 

I hope they build a free open Multiplayer mode to play online anytime I want with players. 

 

Dont tell this is a different kind of game because for me that sound bs.

Sorry lad, this is no counter strike. Most people here work most of their time, so chances are that you wont find anyone in the lobby to play with without arranging a meet...

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I don’t play counter strike. I play only hard core games. So change your older chip. Old fashion grandFa don’t set the future rules in any part of the earth, and in case that happen then something gonna end soon.

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2 hours ago, Chiquito said:

I hope they build a free open Multiplayer mode to play online anytime I want with players. 

 

Dont tell this is a different kind of game because for me that sound bs.

Can't help if you feel that way. The reality is that combined arms combat tactics is about as complex as it gets to coordinate between different players. A "free for all" type of multiplayer game where players drop in and out is something entirely different. It may look, on the face of it, similar enough but as soon as you start looking beyond the superficial surface of the gameplay you will find substantial differences.

 

That being said, I'm not categorically refusing to work on it, even if this would mandate substantial changes to the overall character of our work. But we won't work on it any time soon, simply because we have much different priorities due to the fact that the main application case for Steel Beasts Pro (sic!) is training and education. This, and necessary changes to the software architecture to keep the application maintainable, will dominate our development work for the foreseeable future.

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Posted (edited)

Ok. But just keep in mind keep the Sim like that doesn’t help to you guys and also will keep the Sim unknown for the whole game community. With a server MP will be More people, more fun, more teams. Anyway you should have a good reason doing so.

 

at the same time I think this Sim have a lot of very good stuffs. I even don’t care much the graphics but anyway they also are important for realistic scenarios. 

 

Keep the good job as always.

Edited by Chiquito

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3 minutes ago, Chiquito said:

Anyway you should have a good reason doing so.

Well a big part of the "good reason" is that the main customers do not need that functionality.

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, Chiquito said:

One of the NO NO I find in the Sim is the must to concert a meet to make a Multiplayer play. I hate that.

 

I hope they build a free open Multiplayer mode to play online anytime I want with players. 

 

Dont tell this is a different kind of game because for me that sound bs.

How should this multiplayer mode look like? What kind games/gamestyle do you think of?

Any current game you could compare it to?

Edited by Grenny

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On 7.3.2019 at 9:46 AM, Chiquito said:

One of the NO NO I find in the Sim is the must to concert a meet to make a Multiplayer play. I hate that.

 

I hope they build a free open Multiplayer mode to play online anytime I want with players. 

 

Dont tell this is a different kind of game because for me that sound bs.

 

On 7.3.2019 at 5:12 PM, Grenny said:

How should this multiplayer mode look like? What kind games/gamestyle do you think of?

Any current game you could compare it to?

...

 

So, no reply at all? Thats a bit disappointing.

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Posted (edited)
On 3/7/2019 at 3:06 AM, Chiquito said:

I don’t play counter strike. I play only hard core games. So change your older chip. Old fashion grandFa don’t set the future rules in any part of the earth, and in case that happen then something gonna end soon.

 

turn it around- ask the developers of war thunder or battlefield to scale their games into something different, and watch how fast that happens. so you insist that it can be done on this forum instead 'and there is no rule on earth preventing you from doing it'-  well, the issue isn't whether it can or can't be done, after all, they could combine basketball with golf and it might still be a mess of a sport and a big waste of everyone's time at the end, but nothing that went against the laws of the universe after all. not a relevant point.

 

first, these types of questions come up often enough but it is predictable each time they are asked as if no one has ever brought it up before. and i will argue that you are seeing exactly the type of people who want to play either type of games naturally attracted to them as they are- you don't need to entice people to play more steel beasts if only it had that sort of multiplayer experience, they would have been here already because they liked steel beasts if that were the case. if those games have comparably large audiences, it's because those games appeal to that type of audience, which is larger. therefore the medium is the message- simply, watch how people actually behave, and there is your answer. people who prefer the large scale multiplayer experience without the steel beasts code will naturally play those games without being cajolled.  that's what a free market predicts, and that's what you're seeing.

 

second, there is a certain idea that everyone should be able to have their cake and eat it too. in other words, why can't you make something that does it all, and the interesting point about this is how often that doesn't work. design decisions become compromised or muddled, and to borrow a cliche, the result often ends up doing no area particularly very well when it tries to do it all. some people get a kick out of steel beasts' instant action mode, i'll say it is my least favorite mode- as a pure action game, that seems to miss the point of what steel beasts does well. imagine steel beasts imported into simple, small maps where players spawn in and start the trigger pulling right away, players getting blown up every few seconds, re-spawning and doing over. that gets boring, just like steel beasts instant action gets boring, and it neglects most of the ingredients of what steel beasts was designed to do. getting a kill after spending time making plans is in its own way a lot more satisfying than having them come too easily- just like everything else, the easier or more abundant an experience is, the cheaper the satisfaction which goes along with it. this has been shown in experiments (in blind experiments, test subjects showed preference for a higher priced wine than a cheaper one, though they are tasting the same wine in either case), and i'm sure you can think of others.

 

my recommendation is to play both types of games if you like both- play the multiplayer oriented action games when you need that fix, then move to steel beasts when you want something else.

Edited by Captain_Colossus

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On 3/7/2019 at 6:36 AM, Gibsonm said:

Well a big part of the "good reason" is that the main customers do not need that functionality.

 

Ok understood. Anyway this functionality will bring new customers. If you feel good doing so then it’s okay.

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I think that having seperate installers (maps/terrain - core game) is a good Idea, mainly because as Ssnake stated, you wont have to re-install everything when you upgrade, or whatever changes could effect the core game.  Prepar3d (Lockheed Martin) flight sim has a similar structure in it´s latest versions, basically it uses three different installers, "Client", "Content" and "Scenery". Depending on what has been updated and/or what you are interested in updating, you choose what to download/update. 

 

As for the comments above with regards to MP, I would prefer a bigger MP count/host as default then the present one, with out the need of asking for anything special. Say like a max of 18-20 players for someone that would/can host it.  At present it´s a bit limited IMHO. In order words, for the PE version to be able to host a 18-20 player match.

 

Red

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The "PE Server" version supports exactly that, and I haven't been shy giving free licenses to communities with sufficiently capable game servers...?

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Posted (edited)
On 3/13/2019 at 3:10 AM, Red2112 said:

At present it´s a bit limited IMHO. In order words, for the PE version to be able to host a 18-20 player match.

 

Red

 

As Ssnake alluded to if you can justify (a subjective term) needing one, i.e. you run a VU or suitable group, then they often provide a "PE Server" version.

 

It has the same functionality as the ordinary version but with the maximum users cap removed, hence why Rolling Thunder and other events have 30+ participants.

 

However you need:

 

a. a suitable machine / internet connection to run as a Host and

 

b. a suitable scenario. Ones with lots of dismounts or masses of smoke, tend to generate lots of network activity and those with marginal connections will suffer as that information attempts to be sent to all participants.

 

Edited by Gibsonm

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6 hours ago, Chiquito said:

 

Ok understood. Anyway this functionality will bring new customers. If you feel good doing so then it’s okay.

 

Feel free to sign a military contract if you can afford it. These are the "main customers" I was referring to.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Gibsonm said:

 

Feel free to sign a military contract if you can afford it. These are the "main customers" I was referring to.

Nah, it's just that some people think another World of Tanks clone will bring in zausands of new customers and piles of ze money. B|

 

I would hate it, if esim would invest their efforts into that, I'd be a huge risk for them...and would destroy steelbeasts as the game I like. (and the point that someone lists the argument that is would change SB at the core as "BS" is an instand red-flag)

Edited by Grenny

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2 hours ago, Ssnake said:

The "PE Server" version supports exactly that, and I haven't been shy giving free licenses to communities with sufficiently capable game servers...?

Yes Iam sure of that Ssnake, and Iam not saying you are not doing that, but not everybody who buys SBProPE jumps in the forum, or knows anything about that, or knows they should ask you about getting a PE server version.  Some of us are used to doing some research and visit forums for example, but unfortunately that´s not the case for all. Yeah, I know, people should read the manual and all that, but they don´t and go the easy way, in other words "plug and play".  Just thought that giving this option straight out of the box, might encourage more followers now with the new map/terrain engine coming up.

 

With regards to PE, well that´s what it is Gibson, a "personal edition", although the main target customers are military for the Pro edition.  As you said, "if you can afford it" which is not the case for most of us, which means the PE version should be looked at and played with different eyes/attitude because one can expect just about anybody buying the PE version.  Another thing is how it should be played, or intended to be played, which is a whole different story.

 

 

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8 hours ago, Chiquito said:

 

Ok understood. Anyway this functionality will bring new customers.

 there have been different versions of this over the years, i.e., bring a challenger 2 tank in, or bring a t-72 in, or more equipment that isn't so american or german focused, and you'll have lots more users bum rushing to play steel beasts. this never really seems to actualize the way it is predicted. you probably always gain more new players with each new release of steel beasts, but it doesn't necessarily correspond to the specific thing that people tend to base their conclusions on. i think people who make these kinds of statements may be well meaning, but they are projecting; in other words, it occurs to them if they like a thing, that must be how lots of other people feel about it.

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19 hours ago, Gibsonm said:

 

Feel free to sign a military contract if you can afford it. These are the "main customers" I was referring to.

 

Yeah, I got you thanks anyways. I am just a peaceful multiplayer fan of the finest hardcore military simulators. 

 

Sadly in this forums you request something to improve and some users jump out telling you go Counter Strike better, which sound arrogant as hell...

 

but hey here is my support. I appreciate your job!

 

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Posted (edited)
22 hours ago, Ssnake said:

The "PE Server" version supports exactly that, and I haven't been shy giving free licenses to communities with sufficiently capable game servers...?

 

If you think this is practical possible go ahead. The people want to have a flexible schedule to shot some rounds I guess that’s why my request. If some teams are willing to keep a server 24/7 This gonna be a lot of fun for the big MP players. 

 

My opinion. Do it

Edited by Chiquito

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2 hours ago, Chiquito said:

 

If you think this is practical possible go ahead. Chiquito thinks the people want to have a flexible schedule to shot some rounds I guess that’s why my request. If some teams are willing to keep a server 24/7 This gonna be a lot of fun for the big MP players. 

 

My opinion. Do it

Fixed your post, free of charge.

 

As you don't say how that game is supposed to look like, its very difficult to take you serious.

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, Chiquito said:

If some teams are willing to keep a server 24/7 This gonna be a lot of fun for the big MP players.

 

That isn't how it works.

 

It needs a person to start sessions, load scenarios, then end the session, etc.

 

You are making an assumption that a "24/7 server" SB server would be somehow automated (like "Waste of Time" [* my term, not eSim's or anyone else's], etc.) or that eSim can afford to employ staff on a rotating 24/7 shift just to start a MP session whenever you feel like it.

 

Even if there was a person there who determines what scenario is loaded - e.g. 6 players, you want Leopard 2, 2 others want M1's, someone else wants recon, yet others want Infantry??

 

This is why the current planned events usually detail what will be played and the available positions.

 

The "unplanned" Ad Hoc ones tend to have 20 - 40mins discussion of "what are we going to play" once a suitable number of people turn up.

 

Then you have availability issue - Most SB scenarios go for say 90 - 120 mins so organising a group of people who can hang around for that long is problematic (unless you just accept that people will quit before the mission completes). If you only have 15 mins "spare", there is no point starting.

 

3 hours ago, Chiquito said:

My opinion. Do it

By all means ask, but I for one don't respond well to this sort of "direction".

 

BTW, I think we have gone well off the "Roadmap".

 

Edited by Gibsonm

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Posted (edited)

IMHO, the main technical issue making it difficult to have any kind of online "pick a game and join" system is that there isn't a dedicated server executable for Steel Beasts that can easily be run remotely to enable an always-available server. It'd need an admin interface to allow it to be remotely controlled and either have some kind of built-in scheduling system to automatically cycle through scenarios, or otherwise be controllable via external scripting software.

 

Hypothetically speaking, a web-based server browser would probably be the easiest way to make things work, similar to another sim I play, Condor2: http://www.condorsoaring.com/serverlist/?wdt_search=cndr2

 

A Steel Beasts version could be very similar, showing the current server state (Assembly area, Planning, Running, AAR, etc.,) the scenario currently selected, players connected, voice comms server link, and so on. The "Join" button would use a custom URI protocol (just a link along the lines of "sbppe:SDFKJSDFLKSJDFLJKSDF") to launch Steel Beasts and automatically join the selected server.

Edited by Rotareneg

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32 minutes ago, Rotareneg said:

IMHO, the main technical issue making it difficult to have any kind of online "pick a game and join" system is that there isn't a dedicated server executable for Steel Beasts that can easily be run remotely to enable an always-available server. It'd need an admin interface to allow it to be remotely controlled and either have some kind of built-in scheduling system to automatically cycle through scenarios, or otherwise be controllable via external scripting software.

 

Hypothetically speaking, a web-based server browser would probably be the easiest way to make things work, similar to another sim I play, Condor2: http://www.condorsoaring.com/serverlist/?wdt_search=cndr2

 

A Steel Beasts version could be very similar, showing the current server state (Assembly area, Planning, Running, AAR, etc.,) the scenario currently selected, players connected, voice comms server link, and so on. The "Join" button would use a custom URI protocol (just a link along the lines of "sbppe:SDFKJSDFLKSJDFLJKSDF") to launch Steel Beasts and automatically join the selected server.

 

You rock. Thanks

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