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T. Frankowski

Using Steel Beasts with Vorpx (VR)

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Posted (edited)
17 hours ago, Gibsonm said:

There is a world of difference between those environments.

 

The Sim is required to emulate (or dare I say simulate) reality.

 

Your $40 simulation package is not going to drive $XX million AFV development programmes.

 

Like I said happy that it works for your entertainment (until of course people in say TGIF complain about your rapidly reduced target acquisition times compared to theirs) but as it doesn't simulate what is on a real vehicle we aren't interested.

I said it makes target acquisition better, not worse, however, like I said in my previous comment, it doesn't bother me that much. by the way the majority of SB players use a mouse and keyboard, that's not simulating much, I use a HOTAS, specifically a F-16 replica stick and throttle, so in my defense, that's more replicated physical controls than a mouse and keyboard but that's with the civilian version, I know when it comes to military training you have the 5,000 dollar Cadillac and such.. once again, read my comment above this one. This argument is OVER for me as I'm mature enough to end it where it began. EDIT: And even with VR, since my program that runs SB in my headset only does a fraction of 3D transitioning from the monitor, my frame rates are exactly the same as when I use the monitor, even with a big operation, the same Op that Kanium had last sunday.

Edited by T. Frankowski

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2 hours ago, T. Frankowski said:

I said it makes target acquisition better, not worse,

IRL, this is not really true...

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, Grenny said:

IRL, this is not really true...

Do you realize how accurate your own body movement is compared to a machine? Much more accurate. EDIT: When I mean accurate I mean accurately tracking the target, using your own head gives you the ability to feel when the proper speed is given to track. That's not to say controllers aren't accurate, but you can find that tracking speed of a target much quicker than using a device that's not your own body.

Edited by T. Frankowski

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Posted (edited)
7 minutes ago, T. Frankowski said:

Do you realize how accurate your own body movement is compared to a machine? Much more accurate. EDIT: When I mean accurate I mean accurately tracking the target, using your own head gives you the ability to feel when the proper speed is given to track. That's not to say controllers aren't accurate, but you can find that tracking speed of a target much quicker than using a device that's not your own body.

The movement of you body, only gets translated into weapon lay correctly, if the device used for tracking you movment is good enough.

This is a problem specially for very slow movements, and for tracking f.e. head movements on a bouncy plattform like an IFV.

 

Thats why even on helicopters, only the general direction of observation/gun in controlled by headmovement. The actual weapon laying and aiming is done by other means.

 

On an AFV it is rather pointless, as often the moves of the platform will "override" any signals a movementsensor will receive.

So, for the forseeable future, it is very unlikely that any customer will pay money to esim to implement stuff like that,

Edited by Grenny

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Just now, Grenny said:

The movement of you body, only gets translated into weapon lay correctly, if the device used for tracking you movment is good enough.

This is a problem specially for very slow movements, and for tracking f.e. head movements on a bouncy plattform like an IFV.

 

Thats why even on helicopters, only the general direction of observation/gun in controlled by headmovement. The actual weapon laying and aiming is done by other means.

Okay you got me there, IRL it is a bit different, I didn't take the shakiness into account.

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When all is said and done if someone who is using SB for entertainment purposes, wants to be in VR, try VorpX. I have used it and it works just fine, the 3D injection is not of highest quality, you can't move your head forward and back but you can look around the same way as with the mouse/TrackIR and the tank is your surroundings 🙂. This thread should be about people like me who want the same results, a workaround for VR for their/our enjoyment, this thread isn't about implementing this into the game by eSim or using it for the military. I hope everyone understands that.

 

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Posted (edited)

 

On 5/2/2019 at 5:04 AM, Gibsonm said:

Like I said happy that it works for your entertainment (until of course people in say TGIF complain about your rapidly reduced target acquisition times compared to theirs) but as it doesn't simulate what is on a real vehicle we aren't interested.

 

9 hours ago, T. Frankowski said:

I said it makes target acquisition better, not worse, however, like I said in my previous comment, it doesn't bother me that much.

 

"Faster" acquisition time = better (not worse).

 

As to simulation Vs entertainment that's why I specifically mentioned TGIF (I've made it bold). In real training we aren't using VR, so acquisition times are accurately represented.

 

In the entertainment sphere I suspect (as alluded to) there maybe issues when you can acquire a target faster (i.e. better) than someone with a mouse, or with a joystick, or with a HOTAS. Whilst this may not bother you, it may bother others in the session.

Edited by Gibsonm

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1 minute ago, Gibsonm said:

 

"Faster" acquisition time = better (not worse).

 

As to simulation Vs entertainment that's why I specifically mentioned TGIF. In real training we aren't using VR, so acquisition times are accurately represented.

 

In the entertainment sphere I suspect (as alluded to) there maybe issues when you can acquire a target faster (i.e. better) than someone with a mouse, or with a joystick, or with a HOTAS. Whilst this may not bother you, it may bother others in the session.

Read my above post.

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Posted (edited)
16 hours ago, Ssnake said:

That you have no problem with lower frame rates doesn't mean that eSim Games could declare Steel Beasts "VR ready". You're free to ignore my advice, even when you explicitly asked for it. I would however appreciate if you would make it clear that it is your opinion that the official specs given out by Oculus can be safely ignored, and that other people might come to different conclusions, even if you happen to disagree with them.

 

Officially, Steel Beasts Pro is not suited for VR headsets, and won't be for the foreseeable future.

I'm pretty sure people who buy you're game know this...

I mean come on, were not playing War Thunder here.

you sound so cynical. 

Edited by Wolfseven

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This thread should be about people like me who want the same results, a workaround for VR for their/our enjoyment, this thread isn't about implementing this into the game by eSim or using it for the military. I hope everyone understands that. What I'm trying to say is for people who feel VR is what they want over everything else, even if that means maybe having a disadvantage due to resolution etc, then this thread is for them. Not for the military, not for the developers. It's a workaround for VR for the hobbyist that would like it. Plain and simple, I hope you understand that.

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7 minutes ago, T. Frankowski said:

In the entertainment sphere I suspect (as alluded to) there maybe issues when you can acquire a target faster (i.e. better) than someone with a mouse, or with a joystick, or with a HOTAS. Whilst this may not bother you, it may bother others in the session.  

I only play cooperatively with other players not against them. So that doesn't matter. They would probably thank me for having a faster setup because I might just save their life.

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8 minutes ago, Wolfseven said:

I'm pretty sure people who buy you're game know this...

you sound so cynical. 

That's not my intent. But I read some of the earlier rebuttals to my statements as an attempt to bring me to officially endorse the use of VR headsets with SB Pro, something for which it isn't designed and, as far as my understanding of fundamental requirements for a good VR experience are concerned, won't meet - neither now nor anytime soon. If I knowingly make a false statement about product capabilities I'm opening the door to litigation for false advertisement. Maybe some people don't understand this. Like I wrote, if you want to try it out and if it works for you, that's awesome, go for it. But I can't make an official statement that everything will be A-OK when I know that it won't be.

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Feel free to continue discussing your experiences with VR headsets and Steel Beasts. I would like to put a closure on this thread up to this point since I have said everything there is to say from eSim's perspective. I also believe that GibsonM and Grenny have sufficiently contributed from the perspective or real-life relevance.

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