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Lack of dust [RESOLVED]

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Where has the smoke and dust from H.E. rounds going off??? We had it in 4.023 but now all I have is some pale grey smoke..

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One other thing to consider-  amount of dust created by explosions depends of  the map theme settings for the each type of terrain present on given map.  As far as I can see, a lot of stock maps  have   dustiness for the grass type of terrain set to zero or close to zero,  so   dust visuals will be  very subdued or not visible.

 

But if  you don't see dust on desert maps, then there is a problem.

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4 minutes ago, TSe419E said:

Does moisture cocnrent of the geound make any difference?

Yes, it should reduce amount of dust

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Posted (edited)

I can confirm @delta6's results. No dust from an HE barrage even on terrain where the theme calls for dust (60+)

SS_11_07_51.jpg

Edited by Splash
Add screenie.

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Saying "it's a woodland theme" doesn't help at all to identify the issue.

We don't know "which" woodland theme exactly unless it's uploaded here.

But before you do that, review it yourself!

 

The question is, what are the dustiness settings of the terrain type in question (both dry and wet), and what are the initial weather condition of the scenario (the determine the initial water saturation of the ground), and what are the weather conditions up to the point in the scenario where this (lack of) dust was observed.

 

Only if all these factors are know we can make a statement whether this is intentional/a consequence of the conditions, or if it is a bug.

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Woodland summer theme and the desert is middle east fortified..Summer season should be bone dry...In 4.023 in any season the dust and smoke was abundant..

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Well, in my case, it's a simple test scenario on a portion of the map used in the Camp Hornfelt series (which, if IRC, is Blauheim ter. + plain41 hgt).


It's shortly after mission start; a sunny day and there is/has been no precipitation. (Ground Saturation setting is 0 -- unchecked and grayed out).


The Theme is one of those provided with the sim: "eSim_Woodland_(summer) high vis woods," which has dustiness settings ranging from 20-75 (excluding bog and water, which are 0).
The sandy area in the screenshot has a setting of 75. (But I get the same visual result on all types of ground; I called HE strikes in several areas of the map and watched them).


Using an edited version of the same theme where I raised all dustiness levels to 50 or above ... yields the same result: An HE barrage shows the short-lived white and gray smoke/particle effects of each blast ... but no lingering dust is kicked up. Vehicles crossing the same ground do leave dust trails. 

 

 

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For another example, I decided to drop some arty on a little vignette I set up for an earlier screenshot on a different map.


This is the OTWBeaudesert ver. 3 map with the theme from Panzer_Leader's Woodhill scenerio, which I extracted and edited for bumpiness issues.


The dustiness setting for this particular patch of ground is 60. No precipitation. An ASLAV-25 leaves a dust trail. But about 30 seconds into an HE barrage that covers the entire viewshed ... things are rather, let's say, unobscured.

 

 

SS_14_05_03.jpg

SS_14_14_42.jpg

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If only I saw this thread earlier then I could have saved everyone some time LOL.

 

The dust was removed on HE explosions for performance reasons. It was one of the optimizations, and this is especially true for artillery (the dust was removed, and the dirt spray was added instead). Now it could be that we add some dust back later, but right now that is intentional (AFAICR) until a better approach is made here that isn't so heavy on performance.

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13 minutes ago, Volcano said:

we add some dust back later

A dropdown menu in the settings (no dust, some dust, normal dust) would be wonderful.😎

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Posted (edited)
23 minutes ago, Hoover said:

A dropdown menu in the settings (no dust, some dust, normal dust) would be wonderful.😎

But at least IMHO, you want the dust to vary by terrain type and weather.

 

If your vehicle crosses say concrete, then a ploughed field then well irrigated pasture, then a river  / marsh, you want the dust during the journey to vary (also impacted by recent rains etc.).

 

You don't want a global setting that says regardless of the terrain you'll see "some" dust (leaving aside the subjective measure of "some").

 

Edited by Gibsonm

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18 minutes ago, Hoover said:

A dropdown menu in the settings (no dust, some dust, normal dust) would be wonderful.😎

That would be terrible. Obscuration needs to be identical irrespective of graphics detail settings. This isn't just an atmospheric/aesthetic consideration; obscuration has a very real tactical effect. Any slider could only influence the looks marginally. But we haven't yet found a proper mechanism to do exactly that. But at least we're working on a solution that creates consistent results, irrespective of the artillery fuze settings (ground or airburst); right now, it's mostly airburst rounds that create dust - something that won't remain that way.

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I understand the performance issues (re: Volcano's post).

But it seems to me that removing it has a tactical impact. I agree the slider suggestion is a nonstarter. As Ssnake says, the effect needs to be the same for everyone. But hopefully the effect will return to at least some degree.

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Just now, Gibsonm said:

ou don't want a global setting that says regardless of the terrain you'll see "some" dust (leaving aside the subjective measure of "some").

 

As I understood the case, the scenario designer sets the parameter which influences the amount of dust created. If for example a shell explodes or a vehicle drives by. Now we have a situation where (for performance reasons) only dust of vehicles 🚗 🌪 is visible, not from exploding shells. Because I sometimes write before I think, I read my own post again but sorry,  I could not find the section where I demanded dust „...regardless of the terrain...“

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I at least didn't read it that way, and before everybody needs to breathe through paper bags again: We're working on it, and will find a solution. We intended to fix this before the release when the decision to remove it due to performance reasons was originally made, but it's one of the things that fell through the cracks and we forgot about it because of the gazillion other things that needed attention.

OK, so we'll do it in one of the next patches.

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28 minutes ago, Ssnake said:

Obscuration needs to be identical irrespective of graphics detail settings.

Yes in multiplayer, less in single player. As far as I know in multiplayer mode the hosts enforces certain rules. The amount of dust could be one of them. The single player could set the dust according to his hardware.

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Ideally however, the degree of obstruction and its duration would be "realistic" in either mode, and sliders would only control "how pretty" the obscuration was. Unfortunately we haven't yet found a solution for that.

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