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Steel Beasts Complexity

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I've not taken the time to answer this question because it is quite a complex question!

In short, no - SBProPE is not too complex.

In fact, the "complexity" level is the no 1 reason that drew me to the "game" in the first place, and also kept me here.

But I'm one of those that always see something to learn, something to test or something to not understand(?!!). Not a generic "gamer" per se, I guess. I do not have any suggestions at the moment except "keep level as is". It is unique and extremely satisfying.

 

 

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I have to admit that I have not been doing much SB Pro PE.

 

I have been busy working on 2 tutorials, or rather “How I got this to work” thingies. I have just published the first, but number 2 needs more work.

 

What I really like about SB is the diverseness in complexity. From the fairly simple as Driver, Gunner over TC, Platoon leader to higher and higher levels of command.

 

My level of Complexity acceptance pretty much ends at the TC level, it exceeds my multitasking skills. Nope, I do not carry a hidden TC around in my belly.

 

I find it great that the possibilities are there for those with the skills and inclination.

 

I think that as long as you keep the possibility for the levels of complexity intact for those so inclined, it would be fine to add more complexity.

 

What I do find offputting and I am pretty sure that I am not the only one, is the difficulty in finding out how to do stuff in SB.

 

Unfortunately the way the wiki and forum is set up, makes it difficult to determine where to look for the answers to the current problem or how to do a certain thing in SB.

 

Sometimes it is mentioned in the manual, the wiki or a review, that something is possible, but not how to do it.

I know how to “RTFM” And I am very happy to say, that fortunately this is not one of those places. People are very generous with their willingness to help here.

 

I also know how to do a search but am sometimes hampered by not being a native speaker and writer. When I would translate a word or phrase into something that makes sense to me and the ones actually used, are different, then it becomes difficult to find anything. Unfortunately I’m an expert at it. The Google Fuu is weak in this one.

 

The structure of the forum is so that it at times, can be very timeconsuming to find the answers.

When the Goldnuggets are hidden on something like reply 6 on page 6 and reply 20 on page 22 of a thread, it takes time to find. Also if it is a long thread, there is the risk of the early answers no longer working.

 

That the manual is for both SB Pro and SB Pro PE, has given some “Hey Cool, we can do that! Oh Bugger! It does not work in the PE version, Blahhh.” moments.

 

This is not only a problem with SB. Unfortunately it is becoming more and more prevalent all over the internet.

It becomes very frustrating spending several weeks in a row, searching for answers for DCS World, MMJoy2, SB and other stuff for 4 hours, for each 1/2 hour work/play/sim/fun. Mesa no liken.

 

What I would like to see is a forum section only for tutorials, guides and “how to,s” threads.

My thought is that the best place would be on the forum frontpage under the Support section.

It could be called something like “Tutorials, Guides and “How to’s”

It should be possible to comment and ask and answer questions in each thread.

 

I am suggesting a forum section as I believe, that is more likely to be a first stop for and a great help to new users and easier to find than a Wiki entry. My personal opinion.

 

I have just posted my first SB “How to” in the support section, as an example of how it could be.

“Using multiple controllers with SB Pro PE” I would be very happy if it could become a part of such a section if we get one.

 

My next one would be headed there as well:

“Multiple views with SB Pro PE on a single PC” It does however need some more work and I need to ask some questions first.

 

Keep up the great work that you do.

 

 

Edited by DanTDBV

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I'm hoping you have:

 

1. Looked at the Wiki

2. Scanned the various PDF how to guides that I wrote which eSim graciously included in the documentation section of the software itself.

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Coming some time next year we'll start a series of tutorial videos for YouTube. About once every week we want to produce a video covering a certain vehicle (which is not covered by tutorial scenarios), or a certain aspect of the Map Editor, Mission Editor, etc.

 

It is unfortunately very time consuming to produce these videos so we can't turn around the situation in a snap, but hopefully it will reduce your search time substantrially in the future, once that a sufficient stock of tutorial videos has been produced. Needless to say, if there is something that you found and which took you too long to figure out browsing the forum, the Wiki, and the f'in manual - well, let us know what it is so we can make it the topic of a future tutorial. Or we improve the user interface in the future to make it easier to find the necessary elements.

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I have very much looked in the Wiki and the documentation. 

 

My major gripe with the Wiki, is that it is to me, not very clear where I can find the specific information I need. I have mostly been delving into multiple monitors and controller stuff.

Another thing is that a lot of subjects are buried in submenus and some of them in further submenus. I very much prefer to have an subject overview including subsubjects with links on the frontpage. Then I can go straight to the subject, the I need at the moment.

I have a major disadvantage in that very often, when I am looking for stuff I have mental blinds that makes me not see anything other than what I am looking for. 

 

I forgot to ad this to my earlier reply:
In some of my specific cases, it have been mentioned that something is possible and light skimming over the major points, but not how it is done in details. One example is using multiple instances for multiple view. I have only a basic knowledge about networking and how to get it to work. Only a reply from Gibsonm I found in a thread on the subject pointed me in the right direction.

 

For the controllers how to i made, I have had to figure it out on my own.

 

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I know about the videos and I very much appreciate and understand the effort that goes into making any kind of video or tutorial.

 

I do tend to skip video tutorials, as some of them are bloated with unnecessary stuff. This could be helped by putting a time stamp section in the description, with a link to each element of the tutorial. Then it is possible to skip to the part, that you want to learn about.

 

The controllers tutorial I posted and the multiple views one I am working on, are the ones I have been fighting with.

I am very much for making it easier to find elements.

Another reason for suggestion a tutorial section, is that I have a suspicion that it could be an enticement for users to submit tutorials, if it easy for other users to find and learn from them. I know it is for me. 😎

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My interest in Steel Beasts has always been learning what it is like to operate the machines themselves, the same way I enjoy DCS. Learning the details of various fire control systems and their use is my favorite part of the simulation. I appreciate the strategic aspects, but find less interest there. Real Time Strategy games simply aren't my cup of tea.

I have to admit that I find managing more than 4-5 units feels more like work than fun. I prefer focusing on the responsibility of one tank, or one platoon at most, to managing a company or battalion of troops. It would be nice if there could be a commander AI for both sides so that a player could enjoy solely managing a smaller element within the larger battle without the need for micro managing all the elements of a battalion size force.

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6 hours ago, RattyHHG said:

I have to admit that I find managing more than 4-5 units feels more like work than fun. I prefer focusing on the responsibility of one tank, or one platoon at most, to managing a company or battalion of troops. It would be nice if there could be a commander AI for both sides so that a player could enjoy solely managing a smaller element within the larger battle without the need for micro managing all the elements of a battalion size force.

 

When used as a training tool (i.e. its real role in life) there are usually other individuals controlling those other platoons.

 

In a Battalion setting you might have 12+ players.

 

Alternatively once you gain an understanding of routes, waypoints, etc. and the fact that units not quite doing exactly what you intended is often a good reflection of real life then you can pretty easily manage larger formations.

 

If you want to spend 80%+ of your time in the Gunner’s sight, then sure maybe pick only the smaller scenarios.

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11 hours ago, Gibsonm said:

 

When used as a training tool (i.e. its real role in life) there are usually other individuals controlling those other platoons.

 

In a Battalion setting you might have 12+ players.

 

Alternatively once you gain an understanding of routes, waypoints, etc. and the fact that units not quite doing exactly what you intended is often a good reflection of real life then you can pretty easily manage larger formations.

 

If you want to spend 80%+ of your time in the Gunner’s sight, then sure maybe pick only the smaller scenarios.

I get you, but I'm in it solely for the detailed vehicle and crew station simulation. I have little interest in micromanaging an element larger than a platoon. I've done it, I simply don't find it fun.

I'd like to be able to enjoy battalion size dynamic scenarios from a single tank or platoon perspective without having to micro manage an entire side of a battle.
 

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4 hours ago, RattyHHG said:

I get you, but I'm in it solely for the detailed vehicle and crew station simulation. I have little interest in micromanaging an element larger than a platoon. I've done it, I simply don't find it fun.

I'd like to be able to enjoy battalion size dynamic scenarios from a single tank or platoon perspective without having to micro manage an entire side of a battle.
 

You can up to a degree create a simplistic AI behavior using the mission editor's logics system.

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4 hours ago, stormrider_sp said:

You can up to a degree create a simplistic AI behavior using the mission editor's logics system.

Which is what I said previously.

 

21 hours ago, Gibsonm said:

Alternatively once you gain an understanding of routes, waypoints, etc. and the fact that units not quite doing exactly what you intended is often a good reflection of real life then you can pretty easily manage larger formations.

 

Edited by Gibsonm

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11 hours ago, RattyHHG said:

I'd like to be able to enjoy battalion size dynamic scenarios from a single tank or platoon perspective without having to micro manage an entire side of a battle.

To a degree, I see your point.  But SB isn't just a turret simulator any more and hasn't been for a while.  Its moved heavily towards being a combined arms simulator.  To me, the choices are build you own scenarios or you are playing the wrong game.

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