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Hermes

IEDs - what about the prechamber shafts placed during the Cold War on West German roads

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Hello,

 

I much appreciate to see that the possibilities to place IEDS in mission have been extended in version 4.1 widely...

 

Using the right explosives the created craters are really impressive but ...

 

... (yes, users have a "but" many times even if new versions are a big progress/success)) stilll tracked vehicles can pass through them even when using multiple devices of high explosive mass.

 

For cold war scenarios it may be a highlight to stimulate the power of those so called "Sprengschlächte" placed on West German roads to slow down/block the advance of WP-units.

 

Unfortunately I only found German sites showing/explaining their use/effects:

 

http://www.sperranlagen.de/sprengschaechte.htm this site holds even a database with the locations of many http://www.sperranlagen.de/Database/

https://www.geschichtsspuren.de/artikel/verkehrsgeschichte/135-sperren-wallmeister.html

 

Seeing the dimensions of the craters I wud believe that simulating such wud make their (non-)breaching them even more realistic.

 

So if time/money/capacity of Esimgames allows I wud be very pleased to see them in one of the future SB Pro PE versions.

 

 

Nice evening

Edited by Hermes

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3 minutes ago, Hermes said:

Hello,

 

I much appreciate to see that the possibilities to place IEDS in mission have been extended in version 4.1 widely...

 

Using the right explosives the created craters are really impressive but ...

 

... (yes, users have a "but" many times even if new versions are a big progress/success)) stilll tracked vehicles can pass through them even when using multiple devices of high explosive mass.

 

For cold war scenarios it may be a highlight to stimulate the power of those so called "Sprengschlächte" placed on West German roads to slow down/block the advance of WP-units.

 

Unfortunately I only found German sites showing/explaining their use/effects:

 

http://www.sperranlagen.de/sprengschaechte.htm this site holds even a database with the locations of many http://www.sperranlagen.de/Database/

https://www.geschichtsspuren.de/artikel/verkehrsgeschichte/135-sperren-wallmeister.html

 

Seeing the dimensions of the craters I wud believe that simulating such wud make their (non-)breaching them even more realistic.

 

So if time/money/capacity of Esimgames allows I wud be very pleased to see them in one of the future SB Pro PE versions.

 

 

Nice evening

You basicly can modify the size und number of an IED like your want to in steelbeasts right now...put like 5 1000 pound bombs in, and you get a pretty good crater.

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thanks Grenny, I tried this before but the craters' edges allowed the vehiclles to get out "quite" easily altough the crater as such had been impressive. I have not found a configuration yet which comes close to the crater of a Sprengschacht 💣

 

Any findings are much welcome but I fear that the angles of the edges may determine the vehicles' "successes"?!

 

The basic calculation had been

Bei normalem Sandboden war hier auch die Faustformel zur Berechnung recht simpel: Die Schachttiefe entspricht in etwa dem Radius des zu erwartenden Sprengtrichters. Ein sechs Meter tiefer Schacht würde bei einer Auslösung also einen Krater mit rund 12 Metern Durchmesser und mindestens sechs Meter Tiefe verursachen. Diese Sprengtrichter wären im Kriegsfall noch zusätzlich vermint worden, um die Beseitigung und Überwindung des Hindernisses zu erschweren..

 

= The depth of the chambers determines the radius of the crater. Often they had been six meters deep = a crater with 12m diameter and 6m depth !!! wud have been the result of the detonation.  The links even contain the basic rules how to receive the wanted results.

 

The max. depth had been 7.80m. Beyond that the result wud not justify the use of the neeced TNT quantity.

 

I will be off for the next days so I cud not reply immediately...

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On 10/13/2019 at 5:55 AM, Bond_Villian said:

Try reducing the traction value of the underlying terrain in question

I haven't played with map editor yet (in three years!). How tightly can you define the area of terrain subject to low traction?

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From 0.00 to 1.00, in 100 increments (Yes... there is no 0.50, only .49 and .51).

You can set individual parameters for all 16 terrain tile types.

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2 hours ago, Ssnake said:

From 0.00 to 1.00, in 100 increments (Yes... there is no 0.50, only .49 and .51).

You can set individual parameters for all 16 terrain tile types.

I think his question was about how small the terrain "tile" itself could be?  IE: Could it be used to make a small enough area slippery to represent the appropriate effect?

 

ETA: Actually, how small of an area you can control might be totally irrelevant?  Maybe it would be best to surround the whole area with very slippery terrain, thus making the road the only way through and ensuring that players cannot simply drive along next to the road, at least not without penalty.

Edited by Maj.Hans

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just returned I vided all replies on that topic.

 

So the solution is static = the map editor needs to be adapted to the wished slippery effects to deny the vehicles to pass cross the crater.

 

Good to see that 12.5 x 12.5m is the mininum tile size which is more or less the diameter of the iintended crater.

 

A technical question though; Before the "SPRENGSCHACHT" detonates does it mean that the intact road is to have the reduced traction value?! I do not think that the traction effects could be changed based on some changed condition, or?!

 

So retreating or other units passing this area will be impacted by the lower values = the road is ias soft as melting ice in the sun ?!

Edited by Hermes

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An IED crater will remove the road, so the traction of the underlying terrain tile will apply. Arguably it should be the traction of whichever tile type bears the "Is Dirt" flag, but you could just as well argue that the terrain type should dominate (e.g. craters in rock, or swamp terrain, would most certainly retain the traction characteristics).

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o.k., clear. So the road is an overlay to the underlying terrain. I will blow up some more roads now after having adjusted the terrrain and look how the vehicles will crawl out...

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