T-72B ammo count? [RESOLVED]

[Maj.Hans]

Hey guys,

 

Working on a scenario here and thought to myself "Say, those numbers seem a little off"...

 

T-72B m.1984 (The AI model) can fit a total of 18 ready, 22 stowed.  Wiki says it should be 22/22, so I assume one of these two things is wrong?  Missiles correctly exchange with regular rounds, so it looks like if you wanted to you could load it up entirely with missiles.

 

T-72B m.1985 (again, the AI model) has default ammo that doesn't add up.  The numbers in the Ready/Stowed boxes do not match the numbers in the window.  For example the window says 2/2 HEAT but the boxes to the right show 0/2.  It's possible to load up 18/22 just like the m.1984, but the missiles don't seem to correctly exchange with normal rounds, you can't go over 2/0.

 

[Jartsev]

Thanks, this is known problem valid for any in-game MBT with gun-missile armament.

[Maj.Hans]

9 hours ago, Jartsev said:

Thanks, this is known problem valid for any in-game MBT with gun-missile armament.

Ok but if that's the case, why do the different models act differently?  I'd ask you to please look specifically at the T-72B m1984 and T-72b m1985 and compare them directly to each other.  The "ready rack" size seems incorrect, and furthermore, they behave very differently to each other.  Maybe @Ssnake can help shed a little light on this because it seems that some of them are more broken than others?

T-72B m.1984 in real life: 22 rounds of any type.

In ProPE we can only load 18 rounds...  But, we are able to load any combination of ready and stowed ammunition!

This one, other than not holding enough ready rounds, (18 instead of 22), seems to work correctly!

You can load them with 18 Svir if you wish, or 18 Sabot, etc.  I just made a test mission where a T-72B m.1984 correctly worked with a full load of 100% Svir missiles ready and stowed, and it correctly fired and reloaded.

 

T-72B m.1985 in real life: 22 rounds of any type.

In ProPE we can only load 18 rounds ready total.  If you load 18 regular rounds total, and then add two missiles, the regular rounds ammo count is broken.

The default ammo load shows "broken" counts as well.

 

T-64B and T-80U Autoloader in real life: 28 rounds of any type.

In ProPE, on both tanks, we get 24 shells, and 4 missiles.

That's 28, so we're fine.  We may not be as flexible as the real thing, but would they ever actually load more than 4 missiles or so to begin with?

 

The T-90S in real life loads 22 rounds of any type.

In ProPE we get 18 regular rounds, and 4 missiles, for the correct total of 22.  Similar to the T-64B/T-80U the quantities are locked but the total is correct.

 

Edited March 15, 2020 by Maj.Hans

[Volcano]

Ssnake does not need to 'shed light'; when you hear an answer from either myself or Jartsev on the subject of a bug, then you can assume that it is as detailed of an answer that you can get.

 

Regarding the specific issue you mentioned here, its complicated.  At one point ATGMs were "extra", not counted in the carousel (maingun) ammo capacity like they are in real life, so we subtracted maingun ammo from the carousel to reserve slots for it, otherwise you could give the tank full capacity maingun (in the ATGM "slots"), and also give it full capacity ATGMs. That was the past.

 

That said, some additional work was done on the T-72B, and might be possible to carry that over to the other tanks - perhaps, but its not priority.  The other issue of course is when we model something abstractly one way, 10 years ago, then improve one vehicle, then it becomes expected that the other similar vehicles behave in the same way, and this is often simply not practical.

[Maj.Hans]

42 minutes ago, Volcano said:

That said, some additional work was done on the T-72B, and might be possible to carry that over to the other tanks - perhaps, but its not priority.  The other issue of course is when we model something abstractly one way, 10 years ago, then improve one vehicle, then it becomes expected that the other similar vehicles behave in the same way, and this is often simply not practical.

 

I'm more than happy to have it left "winged".  Would be great if we could just patch the regular round ammo counts so they can get the full total 22 loaded though

 

I understand that typically not all of the T-72s in a unit were ATGM armed models.  I've made some scenarios where the player's T-72 platoon has a single AI B model thrown in to give some ATGM capacity, and I've noticed that quite often the AI runs it out of ammo before any others in the platoon...

[Gibsonm]

19 minutes ago, Maj.Hans said:

I understand that typically not all of the T-72s in a unit were ATGM armed models.  

 

The Wiki even has a section suggesting a platoon composition.

[Volcano]

I took a look at it, and the T-72B and T-72B w/ERA has some extra coding there to support the sharing of maingun and ATGM rounds that other vehicles don't have because several vehicles in the T-72 class are playable. That extra detail won't be carried over to the T-64B, T-80 and T-90, but at least I made the two versions of the tank consistent in their correct ammo count for a future update.

[Ssnake]

7 hours ago, Volcano said:

Ssnake does not need to 'shed light'; when you hear an answer from either myself or Jartsev on the subject of a bug, then you can assume that it is as detailed of an answer that you can get. 

Probably even better.