Tank Battle Reports

[Koen]

Where could one find detailed battle reports on platoon/company-level of real battles?

Detailed: meaning minute-by-minute/hour-by-hour.

No preference for the time period, 20st century.
Online or books.

 

Thx for giving me some advice: there are so much books out there, that I want to be sure to get what I’m looking for, before spending money ...

(nb I scrolled through the books thread)

[Hedgehog]

Not sure you'll find the wanted detail at the level you want.

 

More than likely those guys will be trying to stay alive, rather than recording their blow by blow actions for posterity.

 

Of course you could always do a recreation in SB to get a flavour of what happened.

 

[Koen]

2 minutes ago, Hedgehog said:

 

Of course you could always do a recreation in SB to get a flavour of what happened.

 

 
Well, that’s the point in fact:

In order to make some “realistic” SB scenario’s, I could use such battle reports, esp. as my own military experience is rather limited and, most importantly in peacetime...

 

To give an example:
The attached picture summarizes an attack spread out over three hours by some 40 tanks, with disastrous results for the attacker.

I’d like to learn more about this:

How it happened, did the attack happen piecemeal (or not !), when & where was the first attempt broken off, was a 2nd attempt done via the same approach-route, ... ?

 

Our SB-soldiers are just 🤖 robots.

 I need some inspiration to bring some soul in them.

 

Books being expensive, hence my question for advice.

 

[Hedgehog]

You could always try Regimental war diaries?

[stormrider_sp]

The Battle of 73 Easting was well documented by an effort that revisited the site and created a complete simulation study. The only problem is that the public material available of this is a copy of the copy of the copy in an era when copies where still made using paper xerox. Still very interesting.

 

a253991_(73_Easting).pdf a257266 (73 Easting).pdf Battle_of_73E_McMaster.pdf

[Koen]

1 hour ago, Hedgehog said:

You could always try Regimental war diaries?

Checking, thx. 

[Koen]

15 minutes ago, stormrider_sp said:

The Battle of 73 Easting was well documented by an effort that revisited the site and created a complete simulation study. The only problem is that the public material available of this is a copy of the copy of the copy in an era when copies where still made using paper xerox. Still very interesting.

 

a253991_(73_Easting).pdf 21.54 MB · 1 download a257266 (73 Easting).pdf 1.81 MB · 1 download Battle_of_73E_McMaster.pdf 1.06 MB · 1 download

Curious about this, thx 🙏🏽 

[Mirzayev]

"Battle on the Lomba" by David Mannall I thought did a very good job of capturing the thoughts of the 17-19 year old Soldier during the destruction of the Angolan 47th Brigade and Tactical Group One. Interesting too about fighting T-55s with Ratel 90s.

 

"Poilu" by Louis Barthas is probably the most detailed journal of a French Army Soldier during WW1, stretching from mobilization in August of 1914 to the conclusion of the war in November 1918. What is interesting is that CPL (later PVT, then CPL again) Barthas absolutely despises the war from start to finish, so you get to see a very different perspective than the typical "history book." Also interesting is that his collection of journals sat unpublished for more than sixty years after the war, until "discovered" in 1978. Not necessarily a "tank battle," but certainly a way to help breath more life into fictional characters. 

 

Of note, in my experience there is often a wide difference of understanding battles between the Soldier and the Leader level. In the above two cases, David Mannall does a fairly good job of explaining what the plan was, but his perspective is very limited during combat itself. The majority of his writings are about his actions in his actual vehicle. Louis Barthas, by contrast, doesn't care at all about "higher's plan," describing the battles and operations with phrases like "The Bloody and Futile Offensive of September," and "The Verdun Charnel House."  What he does is a very good job of describing the daily life of a French Soldier during WW1. 

 

If you are curious about any excepts, let me know.

 

6 hours ago, Hedgehog said:

More than likely those guys will be trying to stay alive, rather than recording their blow by blow actions for posterity.

This is definitely true. Even in situations where there is time to investigate afterwards, the truth often doesn't emerge for years, if ever.

 

Edit: Probably the best summary of Barthas' book on the internet.

 

 

Edited May 1, 2020 by Mirzayev

[Koen]

6 hours ago, Mirzayev said:

 

“If you are curious about any excepts, let me know.

 

Yes pls, for both, but esp. “Battle on the Lomba" by David Mannall

Thank you!

[Koen]

Here’s some input of mine:

 

* 10 tactical vignettes for Scouts-scenario's:

http://www.lesc.net/blog/scouts-contact-tactical-vignettes-cavalry-leaders-book-tactical-decison-exercises-cavalry-leade

 

* "66 Stories of Battle Command"

-> straight from the NTC: 

https://www.armyupress.army.mil/Portals/7/combat-studies-institute/csi-books/66stories.pdf

 

(I posted this earlier 10 years ago already, but may be of interest to newer forum-members)

[Apocalypse 31]

20 hours ago, Koen said:

* "66 Stories of Battle Command"

-> straight from the NTC: 

https://www.armyupress.army.mil/Portals/7/combat-studies-institute/csi-books/66stories.pdf

Thanks for sharing this!

 

These stories are 40 years old, but 100% accurate and still applicable for today. 

[Mirzayev]

On 5/1/2020 at 1:53 PM, Koen said:

Yes pls, for both, but esp. “Battle on the Lomba" by David Mannall

Thank you!

 

Sure, here are a few to give you a basic idea of the writing style, and perspective.

 

This first quote is CPL Mannall's Ratel 90 coming to the defense of his wingman.

Quote

The forward rush gave me a different perspective on the terrain and almost immediately a large bush caught my attention, it looked an ideal size to shelter an MBT-sized lump, confirmed seconds later by a bright flash seemingly erupting from within the foliage. They were indeed firing on 32, but just missed! Within seconds of 32’s urgent call I’d spotted a section of 100mm barrel protruding from a bush, obviously connected to a tank. Now Three Two had less than 15 seconds before enemy tank crews reloaded and reacquired the jockeying target. The MBT’s position behind the bush meant her crew were blind to our rush from what would’ve been their ten o’clock position. With a HEAT round already chambered, locked and loaded, David halted on my command. By now the back end of the T-55 was visible and I immediately lit it up with 7.62mm tracers. “Gunner new target, ten o’clock, 60 metres, follow tracers … ” In the few seconds of delay as he refined his aim, I silently willed Zeelie to make his shot count before that T-55 had chance to release another round on O’Connor’s Ratel. “Fire when ready!” Herb squeezed the firing button at his right thumb. BOOM! Still pouring ack-ack fire into the bush, I ignored the slap in the face and watched as a split second later a flash lit the T-55. I ripped the spent shell casing from the breach, slammed in another HEAT round, then Zeelie made sure of his aim before releasing a second quick-fire shot. “Driver reverse!” Before we completed the jockey manoeuvre, a larger explosion ripped the turret clean off the tank’s hull. It rose in the air a little, flipping over before toppling upside down like a stranded turtle lying next to the stricken hull. “Three Two, this is Three Two Alpha, target eliminated.”

 

 

This next one is the events leading up to the death of 2LT Adrian Hind. There is actually an entire memorial to this Officer. The Hind Memorial

 

Quote

Seconds after a large explosion ripped under the Ratel’s left front nose plate, 33’s gunner hatch popped open, Kurt ‘Stompie’ Oelofse leapt from his turret sprinting towards our back line, apparently not stopping until a Buffel (Buffalo) – mine-hardened open-top troop transport – scooped him up. Moments later, Hind, the crew commander, who’d somehow managed to clamber down the side of his Ratel, clearly wounded and confused, staggered and stumbled … laterally across the field of battle, up the line toward my side of the front. Of course, he’d never make it that far. The whole Battalion twitched at the news. Commandant Smit immediately ordered a Battalion vuur-gordel (fire-belt or plan) – a bit like in the movies where the guy says ‘you go, I’ll cover you … ’ but this wasn’t just a few pea shooters, this was an entire fucking Battalion! I mean this was like nothing that had probably ever been launched in the history of Bush War, probably in Africa since Rommel and Co. Bok Smit’s vuur-gordel call unleashed every single gun, cannon and artillery asset we had at our disposal, unleashing all the dogs of war onto 47th Brigade. The guns of Lomba brought a barrage of continuous fire onto enemy positions designed to create a corridor for crew and vehicle recovery.

 

This one takes place during the action above. CPL Mannall receives his first wound in the war.

 

Quote

As Zeelie fired a second shot toward our two o’ clock and I dropped back down quickly releasing the next round from its turret housing … ‘CRACK’! At almost the same instant I heard that sound – a sharp pain stung the upper area of my back. “Arggh!” I momentarily shat myself, thinking this was going downhill fast, “Fuck! I’ve been hit!” Despite Zeelie’s grimy face, his skin beneath the grime was suddenly white as a sheet as he looked up at me from his gun sight, brown eyes wide as saucers, “Wat gaan ons doen Korporaal?” (What should we do Corporal?) Thinking on his feet, Corrie launched a blind reverse but after a long few moments of total shitting myself, thinking, is this is how it all ends for me? My life wasn’t flashing before my eyes. I knew this was survivable and realised the pain was getting no worse. I turned in the turret so Herb could inspect my back. “I can’t see blood,” said Herb. That’s when I realised I’d been very lucky … again. “No wait, wait David, I’m OK. Let’s go back in!” We hadn’t reversed much more than twenty metres before halting, then immediately moving forward again, resuming our fire plan in support of the recovery action. I’d just dodged a bullet, a sniper maybe. I was convinced the loud sharp ‘crack’ was the result of a bullet ricocheting and not bomb fragmentation, which makes a different sound altogether. I tried to keep my profile as low as possible until we located and silenced the sharpshooting threat. We were being obviously being fired upon once more but I couldn’t see enemy positions or threats, so they had to be dug in or sniping from up a tree somewhere. I admonished myself for losing sight of the immediate target area during the vuur-gordel, thinking we had the area ahead of us well buttoned down. The crack sounded especially loud and close, it seemed as if the bullet had bounced off the upright commander’s cupola.

 

Edit: I also found a blog post by David Mannall. This is part of Chapter 18 from the book. Of note is towards the end of the post, where he describes the field-expedient way in which they zeroed their unstabilized 90mm cannon by shooting at a tree while on the move. https://8october1987.wordpress.com

Edited May 4, 2020 by Mirzayev

[Koen]

Thank you, Mirzayev 🙏🏽 !!

Blog also vy interesting!

Edited May 5, 2020 by Koen