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Quagmire

'Fire Only When' problem

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Hi guys,

Hopefully I'm missing something really simple here, but what I'm trying to do is set a condition where the enemy will only be fired on if they enter a certain location.

I have an area designated on the map ( a small crossroads), with a few US vehicles in the surrounding area. The enemy is visible to them anyway but what I'm trying to do is set a kind of 'stalemate' situation i.e. the US will only fire if the enemy troops and/or vehicles enter the area - or if the enemy open fire on a vehicle in the designated area.

Any suggestions?

Cheers all!

Quagmire

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there are lots of ways to do it, limiting the range for when to open fire would be easy. Linking a "open fire if" to a region with: "operational known enemy units in region XX is >0" would do it to. but they will start fire at any units nearby, not just the ones in the region. and to make the hold fire again they need to move to a different waypoint with a new set of rules for opening fire.

Edited by Sgt_Anzac
added some info

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Cheers guys!

I was playing around with it and looks like I missed the 'open fire if' option! :redface:

Thanks again,

Quagmire

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Notice that once that the "Open fire" condition is satisfied, it's not limited to those units that triggered the condition but ANY enemy in range, and that the enemy will be engaged in the order of perceived highest threat.

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Hi guys,

Notice that once that the "Open fire" condition is satisfied, it's not limited to those units that triggered the condition but ANY enemy in range, and that the enemy will be engaged in the order of perceived highest threat.

This is exactly the situation I'm trying to avoid. :(

I have a road that contains effectively a checkpoint or roadblock of sorts. Vehicles can pass along the T-junction unharmend but as soon as one turns onto the road in question and enters the designated area they are fired upon. Problem is, as Ssnake points out, every vehicle is then fair game.

I've set a retreat command for a few yards along the line of 'If destroyed enemy in area 1 < 0 then move' (wording is wrong I know but you get the idea). They then retreat to another Stay position and another 'Open Fire If Enemy Forces are in Area 1' comes into effect.

However, they still seem to shoot up everything once the first condition is met rather than obey the second 'Open Fire If' command. :confused:

I'm practicing with this version ahead of the update. I'm thinking of scenarios we can build with civilian vehicles, roadblocks, etc. etc. See where I'm going with this? :)

In the meantime it's back to the drawing board and I'll keep trying.

Quagmire

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A "Cease fire, if..." condition is on my wishlist for about four years now. It is becoming more and more important these days however, so the pressure is rising. Won't happen with 2.5 though, I'm afraid.

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Hi Ssnake,

A 'Cease Fire If' command is just what I need! :)

Hopefully we can get this soon after 2.5 (hint, hint. ;))

I can't figure out a workaround though.

Q

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The only option is to have two firing positions VERY close to each other, connected with a two-way route with embark condition "incremental time > 15s" or so, and hold fire orders.

Create the positions far apart, set the embark conditions, then move the second BP very close to the first. That way the unit will oscillate between the two positions in regular intervals and adopt "Hold fire" orders. It will open fire while the corresponding conditions are fulfilled and while the unit's vehicles are in the battle position, but cease fire at the latest about 14 seconds after the offending unit in the region has been killed. Hopefully this will limit the collateral mayhem and destruction.

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Thanks Ssnake,

I followed your suggestion and it does allow for a break in the firing. I've added quite a few vehicles on the roads to see how it performs, and after destroying the intruder the M2's only killed 3 innocent trucks this time. :)

Bit of work needed, but it's getting there.

Cheers,

Q

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Are you making the "Open Fire If..." an event or a condition? Once an event is true, it stays true, whereas a condition can alternate between true and false.

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Hi guys, here's what I've been playing with.

I have an M2A2 sitting a couple of hundred yards along a road watching a junction. The entrance to the observed road is the T in a T-junction. Once an enemy drives along this road they enter a designated zone, simply called '1' for now. All vehicles have the Hold Fire command set to avoid killing everything within range.

I then have the other settings as follows:

--------------------

BLUE EVENT 1:

Message: Enemy has breached roadblock - Engage!

Unit co/A can see at least 1 enemy forces in region 1 (1)

BLUE CONDITION 1:

Blue Event Roadblock Breach is true

OPEN FIRE IF: (this is set on a Stay position)

Unit this can see at least 1 enemy forces in region 1 (1)

EMBARK ON ROUTE IF:

After true, delay by 0:12

Blue Condition 1 is true for at least 0:02

--------------------

The 'embark if' command is linked to a retreat to a position just a couple of metres behind their current position that also has a Stay command with a duplicate of the OPEN FIRE IF settings shown above. And so it repeats.

Hope that helps.

Q

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Actually Tacbat is partly correct here too. Conditions unlike triggers alternate between true(when their conditions are met) and false(when the conditions aren't met). An event becomes true and then stays that way.

so in your case:-

Set a condition to check for enemy in the region (alive ones only).

in each of the firing positions have the "open fire if" pointed to the condition.

on the routes between the waypoints set the fire control to hold fire.

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Hi guys,

I've been fiddling with this problem a bit more and it sort of works, but not guaranteed.

One thing, on Ssnake's post he said "have two firing positions VERY close to each other, connected with a two-way route with embark condition "incremental time > 15s" or so, and hold fire orders. "

How do you set up a two-way route on the same course line?

I've used the Embark If and Retreat Back If commands together, but they still open fire outside the alloted time or refuse to use the Retreat Back If command even though it contains the same Condition setting as the first BP. Driving me nuts now... :confused:

Q

Edited by Quagmire

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It's super simple to create, with one caveat. You could make a direct connection (New route...) from waypoint N to N+1, and then make another route from N+1 to N. unfortunately both will be overlapping, so it can be hard to select one to set the embark conditions. Therefore I always create an extra vertex that I can drag to a distant location so I can select the route properly, set the conditions, and then drag the vertex back to a position between the two waypoints.

Actually, I just realized that you may not need two waypoints!

You can create a route that starts from N and arrives at N (a "loop" with one vertex). If it is sufficiently short the unit might not even move out even though technically it'd be enroute.

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It's super simple to create, with one caveat. You could make a direct connection (New route...) from waypoint N to N+1, and then make another route from N+1 to N. unfortunately both will be overlapping, so it can be hard to select one to set the embark conditions. Therefore I always create an extra vertex that I can drag to a distant location so I can select the route properly, set the conditions, and then drag the vertex back to a position between the two waypoints.

Actually, I just realized that you may not need two waypoints!

You can create a route that starts from N and arrives at N (a "loop" with one vertex). If it is sufficiently short the unit might not even move out even though technically it'd be enroute.

Hi Ssnake,

I can't get this to work at all! :frown:

I have Condition 1 set stating that 1/A can see enemy forces in Zone 1 for at least 2 seconds.

I have an M2A2 with a Stay position with orders to only fire on enemy vehicles if they enter the designated zone - Open Fire If 1/A sees enemy forces in Zone 1 for at least 2 seconds.

I then have a Retreat route set several yards behind. This has an Embark If set to it stating it should only move if Condition 1 is met then delay the action by 12 seconds - this gives the M2 time to destroy the enemy. The route also has Hold Fire set.

At the end of the retreat route is another Stay command with the same settings as the first.

From here I set a forward route (March, Engage etc.) and set it over the first Stay position. However, there is no way of 'attaching' it to the first position, instead it sits as an 'X' over the BP. This route also has Hold Fire set.

After this none of the conditions or Fire If settings work - they just destroy anything in sight! :(

How do you actually set 2 stay positions with a route that the vehicle can traverse back and forth over and over again?? And I can see no way of setting a 'loop' route. Do you have any examples or screenshots to explain it at all?

This is getting very frustrating. :confused:

I'm definitely looking forward to the 'Cease Fire If' option! :biggrin:

Cheers all!

Q

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Q,

Take a look at the attached scenario and see if it is behaving like you want. Only EN vehicles in R1 (the black square) are engaged. If it's good to go, take a look at the routes for the fire control settings.

ROE_rar.775f85fe883b64034d380281c04b8831

ROE.rar

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Q,

Take a look at the attached scenario and see if it is behaving like you want. Only EN vehicles in R1 (the black square) are engaged. If it's good to go, take a look at the routes for the fire control settings.

Cheers Tacbat!

I've tried to duplicate your settings to see if I understand them fully, but I can't seem to find all the waypoint settings - namely 1 and 2?

I've taken a close-up screenshot of your routes (exploded a bit for clarity), but I can't see what you set for the other routes, I only see 3 and 4 on screen and when clicking to highlight the routes they don't appear. Hope that makes sense.

In my version the enemy were still engaged outside of zone 1. :frown:

th_37180_ROE_122_362lo.JPG

Cheers,

Q

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OK, I'll try and explain what's going on:

WP's 1 & 2 don't exist. (They were the initial points I tried using, but the first attempt didn't go as planned so I deleted them and started over with 3 & 4.)

So the CO starts off with "Hold fire" assigned to the vehicle, not the route from the vehicle to WP 4.

Once at WP 4, the CO will move to WP 3 when an EN truck enters region 1 (the black box). This route has a fire control setting of "1000m", which keeps him from engaging anything outside the black box (the furthest side is approx 1000m from the CO).

Once at WP 3, the CO will "retreat" back to WP 4 along a route with "hold fire" when no alive EN's are in the black box.

Now that the CO is back at WP 4, he waits there until another EN unit enters the box, and he repeats the process.

That's about sums it up.

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Cheers Tacbat,

It makes sense when you put it like that. :) I thought the other 2 waypoints were somehow 'hidden' or locked into the the others! :redface:

Thanks again,

Q

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You're welcome.

I'll send you my Paypal info later... :wink:

:)

You could help users with scenario design part-time and make some cash! ;)

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I'm just happy to see others getting involved with scenario design. Kinda "payin' it forward" from when I started out and got a helping hand.

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