Single Player Campaign

[jdkbph]

Hello,

Just signed up and making my first post.

Being a former M1TP (1 and 2) player/fan, I am very interested in SBPro. The price doesn't bother me per se, however, I am less inclined to "risk" a purchase at that price point and just hope that it will have all the little features that I feel make for a good game (er... sim). So I figured I'd post a question or two...

Most of what I would want to know I've gleaned from reading this forum and various reviews posted on the web. But the one thing that I've not seen mentioned... a thing that I believe is an integral part of any entertainment level sim (eg, FSX, Falcon 4, the Janes sims, Harpoon ANW are all "entertainment" level sims), is a decent campaign system.

Optimally this would be a dynamic system that creates missions on the fly, tracks results from mission to mission, allows one to manage resources/logistics, and all those wonderful things the "good" sim makers used to build into their games.

Realistically, given the nature of this sim, and the stated goals of the developer, I'd probably settle for strings of related missions and be quite happy about it.

Oh, I should mention that I'm strictly single player.

Any info or advice would be appreciated.

JD

[Gibsonm]

Welcome!

The first thing you need to adjust to is that this is not an "entertainment" product that was adopted by the military.

This is a product for the military that now has a slightly limited version (some features removed, not "dumbed down") for the public.

As a result stuff like "campaigns" which entertainment software determine are vital, are not present here (and I suspect may never be).

However, you certainly have access to a very comprehensive scenario and map creation tool set so you can make your own series of engagements up (or you could perhaps download some of the sequential scenarios set up for multiplayer and just command the blue side yourself - sorry but I believe only the red side has scripted moves for these).

For example: Sgt_ANZAC's work which starts here -

http://www.steelbeasts.com/sbforums/showthread.php?t=14346

Another option might be Gary Owen's gradually escalating series of training scenarios based around Camp Hornfelt which are documented here:

http://www.steelbeasts.com/sbforums/showthread.php?t=13886

[jdkbph]

Thanks for the info.

I appreciate the fact that SBPro is sim first - game second, and I do make allowance for that.

I am wondering how much replayability there is for someone who doesn't do multiplayer however. I've heard the term "scripted" used to describe the way scenario AI is built. Does that mean there are no random elements?

I also wanted to ask about controls. Can this game be played effectively and comfortably using a mouse and keyboard? If not, what do the veterans use/recommend?

Thanks again.

JD

[Hackworth]

Hello,

Just signed up and making my first post....Realistically, given the nature of this sim, and the stated goals of the developer, I'd probably settle for strings of related missions and be quite happy about it.

Oh, I should mention that I'm strictly single player.

Any info or advice would be appreciated.

JD

You might really, really enjoy the mission editor. Also, there are a few mission strings or operation type scenarios uploaded. You might be really surprised at the stuff we've churned out in that editor However, being a Falcon 4 dood myself and admiring the campaign engine on that so much i've played several campaigns strictly from the map view managing the ground units and the air ops :biggrin: one day perhaps...maybe SB 2 will be resurrected or something like that with a campaign engine like Falcon. heh, one can dream. but in the meantime, SB/PE rocks.

[Tacbat]

I am wondering how much replayability there is for someone who doesn't do multiplayer however.

Can this game be played effectively and comfortably using a mouse and keyboard?

Replayability depends on the scenario designer.

Yes, some use just the mouse and keyboard.

[Hackworth]

...I've heard the term "scripted" used to describe the way scenario AI is built. Does that mean there are no random elements?...

you can, but it's still built with logic ( if x = </= y then true with x being a random variable chosen at the beginning of the mission through magic). okay, kidding about the magic part. And the scenario designer (a purely technical term for anyone who has saved a .sce file in the mission editor) must create routes for the units to follow. however, you can create so many random variables with branch routes it would be stupid. literally

you might check this page (and the rest of) the wiki to get more information about the mission editor and thus what the actual scenarios are capable of: http://www.steelbeasts.com/sbwiki/index.php/Scenario_Design?chappeep_sbvbforum_wiki__session=c63c7eb0b4bb01d32f1da5efa241b5d5

[Gibsonm]

I am wondering how much replayability there is for someone who doesn't do multiplayer however. I've heard the term "scripted" used to describe the way scenario AI is built. Does that mean there are no random elements?

The AI can be setup to do complex things and indeed there is an option for "random" application but if you only write two options it wont "randomly" generate 5 different behaviours.

It will randomly select between the two that you (or the designer) has written.

I also wanted to ask about controls. Can this game be played effectively and comfortably using a mouse and keyboard? If not, what do the veterans use/recommend?

Well that's a matter of personal taste.

Some use keyboard / mouse.

Others keyboard / mouse / joystick

Others still keyboard / mouse / other controller (ranging from [relatively speaking] very expensive control handle replicas to home built set ups).

For example: http://www.steelbeasts.com/sbforums/showthread.php?t=14365

Thanks again.

JD

You're welcome.

[Ssnake]

I am wondering how much replayability there is for someone who doesn't do multiplayer however.

Well, to start with, we have about, what, 140 single player scenarios ready for download here at SteelBeasts.com?

77 single player scenario files get installed with SB Pro PE out of the box (not counting the 17 Instant Action scenarios and the 212 tutorial files).

Some of the 77 single player scenarios are variants of one, many of the scenarios include random elements, so it's hard to say whether it's 50 "scenarios" or 150, depending on whether you'd count each random element as a separate scenario. I think we have one scenario that has about 50...60 different ways how it can play out, depending on the forces with which the player starts, the route that the enemy takes, and the force composition of the enemy.

So, all in all I think that there's quite some food even for someone who is exclusively interested in single player sessions.

I've heard the term "scripted" used to describe the way scenario AI is built. Does that mean there are no random elements?

It's probably clear from what I wrote above, but let me say it again: No, it does NOT mean that there are no random elements. They do need to get scripted, but many mission designers do this now habitually, so you won't meet too many repetitions I think.

I also wanted to ask about controls. Can this game be played effectively and comfortably using a mouse and keyboard?

Absolutely.

[Superbus]

All of the 6 scenarios I've made so far have enough random elements in them that even *I* don't know what's going to happen when I play them. And I'm new to all this. With branching attack routes it's not too hard to program a dozen different attacks for the OPFOR. Using the "Spawn if..." function you can randomize how much and what type of troops and vehicles will spawn on the map and then embark on the conditional and/or randomized movement routes.

The user interface is in my opinion easy to learn compared other simulation game mission editors. It's hard to even think what could be improved there. I just want more objects to play with - and they are coming, too.

I just have to mention the "Test" button in the editor. Without it making scenarios probably wouldn't be quite so easy. But with that button you can start the game in a special test mode where you can watch what both combatants are doing in real time (click Choose side & View actual on the F5 map).

Yes, you will love the editor if you are into this kind of thing. :grin:

Can this game be played effectively and comfortably using a mouse and keyboard? If not, what do the veterans use/recommend?

I use a CH Combatstick 568 on my desktop PC and a mouse + keyboard on my laptop when I'm "oscar mike". I recommend a programmable joystick with lots of buttons. (I have a very good multi-vehicle programming profile for the Combatstick if you end up buying that stick, just drop me a line if you want it.)

[andym]

I think you will find that a lot of the missions have quite a lot of longevity.I havent yet played one where i have been the outright winner.Theres plenty of "I wonder what might happen if i try it this way next time" in them.Plus there a lot of Missions to be had.Also if i can make a mission then im sure you can.Its fun to do and i like the testing of them to make them as good as they can be.I use the keyboard and mouse to play but i might try using an X box 360 gamepad at some point.

[jdkbph]

Well thanks all. This is exactly the info I was looking for.... and the answers I was hoping to get.

Order placed.

JD

[Hackworth]

Well thanks all. This is exactly the info I was looking for.... and the answers I was hoping to get.

Order placed.

JD

welcome aboard :biggrin:

[Toyguy]

If you do decide to get it, don't write off multiplayer There's nothing quite like it, and it is completely unlike the random multiplayer crap you find on XBox Live, etc. You'll be on a team with several other players, usually about 8 per side, and you'll all work together to accomplish whatever mission you're doing. A great deal of mission planning goes on, and there are no cowboys running around shooting everything in sight including their teammates. Not on purpose anyway!

It is completely different than the usual running, jumping, trigger twitching first person shooter mindset that's so common these days.

I never used to play multiplayer either, until I came across SB Pro and ArmA II at Tactical Gamer. Now I can't get enough....

[mapman]

Also co-op missions where you play with 2 to 16 (if Sean is hosting) players on your side against the computer (for those single player games that give you a few batallions to control).

Quite a bit of fun and you make friends from all over the world to boot!