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Suggestions for Map Editor (Object placement)?


Volcano

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Ditches and trenches are problematic with the same technology as the emplacements because potentially there would be infinitely more of them in a given scenario, and they increase the polycount substantially. That in itself wouldn't be so bad, but it also affects line of sight calculations, and they are being done all the time. So there's "desirability" ... and "practicality" (with respect to performance).

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Ditches and trenches are problematic with the same technology as the emplacements because potentially there would be infinitely more of them in a given scenario, and they increase the polycount substantially. (with respect to performance).

Is this similar how the wadi terrain gets multiplied off map. Does wadi also affect performance in the same way?

Could you list other objects/terrain type that affect performance and at what proportions.

It would be handy to have a reference encase large scenarios need to be optimized for playability.

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About ditches (under roads = rivers 1-3-6m wide): Are they going to be obstacles of some sort in the future, or just eye candy?

I wouldn't call it "eye candy", but that's a matter of perspective. The smaller streams were supposed to provide visual cues to help the player orient himself in the 3D terrain if the map screen was disabled.

(To me, "eye candy" is visual fluff that does not have any functional importance).

The nature of these objects may make it difficult to assign certain movement properties to them. It's probably easier to simply lay a small swamp/bog region under them which would then create the desired mobility effect. Unfortunately this makes it easy to spot passable points from the map view (wherever tiles stand "on edge" or a gap can be seen). An alternative would be to use a duplicate of the normal grassland texture but to assign low traction, low hardness, and high drag values to it in the terrain theme. It would then be more or less invisible but still pose a substantial risk to crossing attempts.

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Is this similar how the wadi terrain gets multiplied off map. Does wadi also affect performance in the same way?

No, the wadis use a different technique. They are "macro scale" objects. They may have steep walls, but they are at least 25m wide - unlike a trench or an emplacement which is only maybe four meters wide (and therefore smaller than the terrain mesh resolution with its 12.5 x 12.5m² terrain tiles).

So far we have tried to simply not add elements which, with realistic usage in any given scenario, would create bad performance hits. But obviously some conditions will always have a bit of an influence on the performance - especially huge polycount scenes that will occur when observing a large urban area from an elevated position, or scenes with a huge overdraw factor like deep forests combined with flat terrain and far-reaching visibility. In this case, if you use a strong zoom factor, even the distant trees will still be drawn in their highest level of detail (which is by the apparent size of a tree in relation to the selected field of view), but of course most of these trees will be obscured by trees in the front. The way how graphics cards render scenes is, to describe it in a simplified way, to first analyze the geometry of a scene (for which the arrangement of all the 3D objects must be calculated). Then all surfaces are discarded that do not face the observer ("backface culling"). Then a depth sort will be performed to determine which objects are occluded by foreground objects. Once that all the triangles have been determined that the player can possibly see, they get filled with textures and the scene is being written to the graphics buffer. Special attention is then given to partial transparency since overlapping transparent objects may change the color of pixels behind them, and the more semi-transparent objects are between a background pixel and the player's eye, the more calculations must be made per pixel. Once that the graphics buffer is complete, it gets sent to the monitor.

So, deep forests can be a problem, also the sprinkling of other trees into forests (homogeneous forests allow the engine to group trees into clusters which then can be treated in a more efficient manner), and large urban landscapes.

The good news is that graphics cards become faster and faster, and we develop better tricks to further boost the overall performance, so it isn't such a dramatic issue as it used to be five or eight years ago.

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Greetings all,

Ref. the placement of objects;

As has been mentioned earlier I agree with a tool to group and space evenly, similar items as poles and lights. Allowing for the placement of these items in a quick and simple method. Currently it's a VERY tedious and time consuming process to lay out telephone and light poles. This new tool should be selectable and then allow the designer to grab the item they want to space and continue to place until completed. May even need to have input parameters on the spacing required.

Additionally I'd like to see the available objects divided into sub categories; IE, desert, woodland, urban. And is it possible have a few "last used" items show up in a visible menu, similar to the way fonts move to the top of the list when you've used them in a word document.

Can the auto rotation of highlighted objects be "turned off" or selected and faced by the user if required? I've had to wait quite a few times for the desert buildings to rotate to find out where the doors or windows are located at.

Again mentioned before, the option to go to an "enhanced" editor that allows users to preselect items from the normal menu and place them in a custom bank of folders for use. This would be very useful for similar design area maps. And can it be made "save-able" for future use.

Currently there are very few visual clues to estimate the "placed" size of an object, is there any way to have a "reference" dimension appear somewhere on the screen listing the l/w/h of the selected object? May have to make this an "on/off" item as after some use the user will remember the objects true sizes.

All for now, just thinking out loud.

Later, 9erRed

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When you shift between object and select it would be nice if it remained on the object you have selected so you need not scroll through the objects each time to find the one you were working with. A simple copy and paste feature would be nice. A way to simply place stone walls rather than individual pieces that neet to be lined up and a command to place a gate or opening rather than a seperate object that again needs to be lined up. Roads placed on inclines should level themselves so it looks realistic when placing them in the mountains. A intersection dds would be nice to add a realistic touch.More road signs.

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As far as an editor layout, Id point to the map editor of the Simulator Railworks as an optimum way of doing it. They split the items according to type, housing, industrial, agriculture,loft, sound etc. It makes it very easy to navigate to the items you want quickly.

Re sound, it would be an interesting idea if when making a map you could pick a list of different sounds to emplace on the map. This may be regarded perhaps a gimmick, but for a sim that increasingly moves towards realism, the scouts are going to be of increasing importance when picking up the sound of approaching vehicles. If you have the choice to partly screen that sounds either on the map when built, or in a scenario to make it harder for them to heard vehicles approaching, it may be a useful idea. I dont know, sound of distant artillery, thunder, factory, railway, motorway sound. Just and idea anyway.

One other thing, it would be good to be able to alter the shoulders of the road according to the terrain it passes over. There is no real way of altering pitch of road in any direction as it passes over terrain. If you could either have a means of terraforming so you can create road or rail cuttings,it would make the roads and building placement look a lot more elegent, and increase tactical options. I accept there are good external products however that will do this, but it would be useful to have it all combined in the same product.

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