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Ohhh Canada!


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Yeah, I've got a bunch of his stuff, including some of his books.

The issue with his stuff is that he researches specific vehicles in specific timeframes and specific places, so you don't get the general rule, but whatever Weird Harold he chose to document.

So that "10" M113 that has been duplicated for the skin - that's a Weird Harold. It's a gunner track, so who knows what they were doing with it.

The overall camo pattern is right (those black arches near the back of the track are pretty distinctive and very common) The callsign is in the right place, but "10" is weird. And that big triangle on the ramp? I've never seen one of those before. That might be an arty thing, or a Germany thing, or maybe it was carrying something strange like fuzes... who knows?

The more typical late 80s through the 90's is that camo pattern, no triangle, Canadian Flag in "subdued" black. Callsign can be almost anything, but to serve as a "generic" track something like 11, 11A, 11B 'cause "10" is weird. CFR on the licence plate. CFR painted on the hull is weird, but may be unit specific. The big leaf on the side of the track is also weird; that might be a Germany thing. Normally M113s didn't have the big leaf (although the tanks did - at first with the white outline, but now just solid black)

DG

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. And that big triangle on the ramp? I've never seen one of those before. That might be an arty thing, or a Germany thing, or maybe it was carrying something strange like fuzes... who knows?

DG

Triangle means "explosives on board", which should go without saying.

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The more typical late 80s through the 90's is that camo pattern, no triangle, Canadian Flag in "subdued" black. Callsign can be almost anything, but to serve as a "generic" track something like 11, 11A, 11B 'cause "10" is weird. CFR on the licence plate. CFR painted on the hull is weird, but may be unit specific. The big leaf on the side of the track is also weird; that might be a Germany thing. Normally M113s didn't have the big leaf (although the tanks did - at first with the white outline, but now just solid black)

DG

Is this more like it? You'd be surprised how hard it is to get good pics of the Canadian stuff.

Image2.jpg.2081e9883c9367677473d8d98b0d7

Image2.jpg.2081e9883c9367677473d8d98b0d7

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Is this more like it?

Except unless it is an artillery vehicle (and "32C" implies it isn't) I don't think you need the tac symbol on the bottom right hand corner of the trim vane (next to the spare track link) or at least you need a non artillery one.

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Except unless it is an artillery vehicle (and "32C" implies it isn't) I don't think you need the tac symbol on the bottom right hand corner of the trim vane (next to the spare track link) or at least you need a non artillery one.

Good catch on the tac symbol....doah! I want it to be a grunt track so 'C" is good. Soon I will get around to the Aussies.

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Well unless you are doing early to mid 1960s (i.e. early stages of Vietnam) we haven't used that M113 with only a pintle MG.

And for the ones we did use (had a T-50 turret on it with 0.50" and 0.30") didn't have multi barreled smoke grenade dischargers on them and the exhaust is in the wrong place for ours (single outlet at the very front on the right hand side hull roof).

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Well unless you are doing early to mid 1960s (i.e. early stages of Vietnam) we haven't used that M113 with only a pintle MG.QUOTE]

True. Would be nice nice to get some variation on the M113 turrets. Namely the Bundeswer with the MG and an ACAV.

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Like the Col. said, tac sign is wrong.

It needs the CFR licence plate - examples on Armoured Acorn are generally correct. One front, one rear, and if you are going to keep the CFR painted on the hull they should match.

Font on callsign is wrong; it is a stencil and it tends to be tall and narrow.

But you are getting close. :)

DG

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Not killing you,they are helping you to improve your masterworks ;) (and ofcourse having different opinions in the process. now that's what's killing ya! :sonic: )

Well, it's not like I have much else to do. The duck hunting sucks and I don't ice fish until next week. Next up LAV III and a Canadian Leopard II, I think.

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Ohhhhh... now I get where the confusion is coming from - your picture is a monument.

A portion of our retired vehicle fleet are converted to monuments and delivered to whatever units have space to host them. These vehicles are stripped down, welded shut, and then the gaining unit can do whatever they want with them.

I have seen any number of monument vehicles painted very strangely. Sometimes because somebody had a Good Idea; sometimes because the RSM got tired of how shabby the thing looked and sent some privates out with some paint and instructions to make it look presentable.

And monuments lack things like the CFR plates and whatnot because they are decommissioned.

This is more typical:

http://i698.photobucket.com/albums/vv345/Alf-Adams/Lahr%20Germany%20vehicle%20display%201978/M113withTOW.jpg

This one I note has the leaf on the front... I've never seen that before on an operational M113; it must have been a 5 Bde (Germany) thing or maybe it was phased out before I got around (1987 onward). Same with the painted-on CFR on the hull. I see too that this picture (1978) has the red/white flag... again, all I've ever seen is subdued flags.

This one here is more recent:

http://www.ipmstoronto.com/articles/military-vehicles/M113/M113s%20At%20St%20Remy%2012.jpg

It has the grouser rack on the outside that was added in the early 90s - see the paint?

Another angle:

http://www.ipmstoronto.com/articles/military-vehicles/M113/M113s%20At%20St%20Remy%2006.jpg

I note this one doesn't have the rubber side skirts... those are always being scraped off on trees, buildings, other tracks... Note CFR plate and yellow bridge classification circle (I've seen both yellow and subdued here)

Rear view - note callsign and NO giant yellow triangle.

http://www.ipmstoronto.com/articles/military-vehicles/M113/M113s%20At%20St%20Remy%2013.jpg

This one is an MRT - note callsign 88B and the EME flag on the front of the hull (maintainers paint that flag on everything)

http://www.ipmstoronto.com/articles/military-vehicles/M113/M113s%20At%20St%20Remy%2016.jpg

And just to muddy the waters, this one has the callsign in a completely different font.

http://www.ipmstoronto.com/articles/military-vehicles/M113/M-113%20Fitter%27s%20Vehicle%2004.jpg

That's nontypical though - the usual callsign font I always saw was that square-ish stencil.

DG

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Ohhhhh... now I get where the confusion is coming from - your picture is a monument.

DG

I appreciate the effort and the research. Still it's a little dissapointing at the lack of pics for the Canadian stuff. I am on to the LAV III and Leopard 2A4+ for the Canucks now. The LAV III is bad ass. Have some pics but as for the Leopard 2A4 its all in Afganistan and tan. I hate tan.

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There aren't a lot of Leo2s in Canada yet. The ones we had in Afghanistan were lend-lease from Germany.

I've seen the new ones - I was in Gagetown for the official rollout (and have a picture somewhere). It is basically the same paint scheme as the Leo1 (solid green), but the leaf on the turret doesn't have the white outline.

You can use whatever font you want for the callsign, because I don't think anybody has painted them on yet.

Too bad you can't alter the model itself; the big Afghan-era Canadian vehicle feature is the water bottles taped to the antennas.

DG

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