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Steel Beasts: Content Wish List

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2 minutes ago, Zaphod said:

Ego damage is not a factor in SB ...... just in multiplayer :)

 

Are you telling us from personal experience Monsieour Zaphod ... ? 9_9

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1 minute ago, Nike-Ajax said:

 

Are you telling us from personal experience Monsieour Zaphod ... ? 9_9

I have no ego ...... but have seen the effects of it ;)
so ... yes :P
Nice try btw :D

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11 minutes ago, Nike-Ajax said:

So no then.

 

I concur with your weight estimate and from a pure common sense standpoint can see what you mean, but neither I nor you have empirical evidence to claim that damage would be incurred and if so at what speed. And if so what damage to vehicle and/or personnel.

 

This of course have nothing to do with the damage the TC and others could and would incur if passing unbuttoned and standing up in hatches through a forest, from branches. As light infantry we started wearing cheap safety glasses at night when doing foot patrols in the forest for just that reason.

What do you expect? Apart from anecdotal "evidence" of our tankies breaking their stuff of all kinds of obstacles(and that on stationary tanks by turning the turret carelessly)...it is hardly possible to publish maintenace reports on the interweb.

Edited by Grenny

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QED

 

So what I say is simply this:

 

Given what you yourself write, then its hard if not impossible to make sweeping claims. By the very nature of its pseudo-academic sources, then it would have to be a more or less educated guesstimate. A estimate that would vary widely by the country and type of vehicle.

 

Unless someone have actual knowledge of it. 

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10 minutes ago, Nike-Ajax said:

QED

 

So what I say is simply this:

 

Given what you yourself write, then its hard if not impossible to make sweeping claims. By the very nature of its pseudo-academic sources, then it would have to be a more or less educated guesstimate. A estimate that would vary widely by the country and type of vehicle.

 

Unless someone have actual knowledge of it. 

Its evidence enough for me. For example a 2A6 doing a wrong turn while unloading from rail, the barrel hitting a lamp post: damage to the thermal sleeve visible, cursing maintenance guys and the tank missing for a day at the range to have components replaced...but its not cite-able evidence.

 

You 40kg number is all good and well, but it means nothing in a dynamic collision where the barrel/turret has a vector of its own...and that vector goes trough an obstacle

 

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12 hours ago, ChrisWerb said:

Speaking of which...

 

 

 

Sure, and at 40sec or so several hundred Kg of tree collapse all of the tank.

 

This same sort of thing injures and kills people every year - 3 so far this year. I have been to two of the funerals.

 

1:40 sec of staged YouTube footage doesn't form the basis for universal truth.

 

Edited by Gibsonm

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2 hours ago, Nike-Ajax said:

Hmmmm ... without entering this discussion, then I would simply like to reiterate that the Leo 2 has an inbuilt safety to avoid damage from barrel strikes.

 

A force of more than 40 kg. in the lateral and horizontal plane, applied on the barrel, will disengage the turret lock. Wheter or not this is enough to avoid any damage I do not know however.

 

I do: It doesn't.

In the 2A4, you'll see hydraulic hoses bursting. Can't happen in the 2A5+ for obvious reasons. Still, alignment of gun barrel and sight is guaranteed to be out of whack at least for non-trivial collision speeds; even if alignment still holds you still need to certify. Finally there's always the possibility of an actual damage to the gun barrel itself. You don't want to find out by way of a banana peel.

 

Like your crown jewels, the gun is a source of great joy but also rather sensitive.

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For the Abrams, I have had to check and replace many guns tubes due to strikes. The worst one that I have seen was 2 years ago when a unit got attacked by the opfor in the early morning out at NTC. The rumor is that the CO and XO jumped in the same tank and rolled out in between 2 platoons. One platoon took contact when they rolled down on a forward slope in which they stopped. The CO tank was falling behind and came over the hill traveling anywhere from 25 to 30 mph. The CO tank hit the stationary tank with the front of the gun tube causing the gun to come out of battery and causing the turret to swing uncontrollably almost 360 degrees. The damage was severe and the crew members came out with only minor injuries. The front piston bolts were stretched and loose which has a 500 ft/lb torque. The rotor caps bolts were also stretched and loose which they have a 100 ft/lb torque. The mantle bolts were loose which has a 700 ft/lb torque. The gun tube was chipped on the end. Luckily the piston spring follower bolts stayed laced and tight which we had to check and relace. The rotor block and trunnions were check for alinement. So many bolts were replaced and many components were checked and replaced as needed ( Azimuth turret brake, manual azimuth drive and azimuth servo). After 2 weeks of work,waiting for special tools and parts. Everything was reassemble and the tank was remotely fired during screening which this tank shot well during that gunnery. The small gun strikes such as a gun tube hitting a tree branch would need to be check via SOUM which is a official Armor Accuracy Checks and rescreened. Small strikes can cause a tank to have to re bore-sight. But in SB, having a gun strike damage implemented, I would see it being more of a hassle than anything. They already have Main Gun damage anyways if your main gun is hit by a incoming enemy round which is enough for me IMO.

Edited by Assassin 7

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56 minutes ago, Ssnake said:

 

I do: It doesn't.

In the 2A4, you'll see hydraulic hoses bursting. Can't happen in the 2A5+ for obvious reasons. Still, alignment of gun barrel and sight is guaranteed to be out of whack at least for non-trivial collision speeds; even if alignment still holds you still need to certify. Finally there's always the possibility of an actual damage to the gun barrel itself. You don't want to find out by way of a banana peel.

 

Like your crown jewels, the gun is a source of great joy but also rather sensitive.

 

Ahem ...

 

And on that note I do believe me and my Crown jewels have nothing more to add ;):D

 

Other than that I can see the arguments having been made above, and I dont believe I have tried to make a case against the effects of barrel strikes. Or the effect of running an armored vehicle into a tree.

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42 minutes ago, Ssnake said:

Like your crown jewels, the gun is a source of great joy but also rather sensitive.

 

I will never think of a gun barrel the same way again. xD

 

To add to the ever growing list (with some fairly mundane requests):

 

1. Differentiation between Red and Blue Artillery when reviewing AARs.

 

2. The ability to divide or attach units in the Planning Phase.

 

3. Being able to separate overlays, and turning specific ones on or off. (For example, be able to either display or not display the enemy SITTEMP.)

 

4. The ability to have more than one callsign be able to load plan files in network sessions. 

 

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No problem Ssnake. Your explanation makes perfect sense and I accept it. I understand that the trees also exist in SB partly to train drivers/commanders not to hit them. It would be nice to see birch trees in SB though, particularly as they do exist in some numbers in Finland for which SB's maps are in all other respects excellent. I'm sure they'll appear in future iterations.

Edited by ChrisWerb

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4 hours ago, Gibsonm said:

 

Sure, and at 40sec or so several hundred Kg of tree collapse all of the tank.

 

This same sort of thing injures and kills people every year - 3 so far this year. I have been to two of the funerals.

 

1:40 sec of staged YouTube footage doesn't form the basis for universal truth.

 

 

I wasn't posting it to be any kind of universal truth Gibson (I had mentioned the possibility of the tree collapsing on the tank in a previous post). I just found it strange that someone was driving an M1 around in Australia deliberately knocking trees down which, as you point out, is a really really dumb thing to do. Filming yourself doing it just takes that to the next level.

Edited by ChrisWerb

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Portraits and statues of Saddam Hussein in Iraq.

 

saddam-sadam-hussein-portrait-in-liberty-square-wearing-traditional-AFWK5A.jpg

portrait-of-saddam-hussein-on-the-street-iraq-A6GB6Y.jpg

Irakkrieg_-_US-soldier_destroys_mural_of_Saddam_Hussein_in_Kerbala_2003-04-05.jpg

o-EDWARD-CHIN-MARINE-facebook.jpg

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The last one looks like an old modified surplus Stalin statue .... a gift from the Russians to get rid of it ... ? :D

Edited by Nike-Ajax

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One thing I really love about this forum is that an observation/request about SB can lead to a discussion where I learn lots of stuff that is completely new to me, despite spending 20+ years on the best armour discussion forum on the web. The amount of exertise here and people's willingness to share it (and that very much includes you GibsonM) makes it an awesome resource in its own right.

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I wish real-time, time based waypoints with triggers, AKA...

 

"move to waypoint X at +5min. mission time, then adopt battle stance".  While at it, a real-time trigger (plan) for whom you assign to, AKA... "when plan B is assigned to unit´s X and B is triggered, then fire at will".  Of course only the PL, CO or XO would have access to triggers A, B, C.  As a CMDR it would be cool to be able to do this things in real-time.

 

As I said in real-time!

 

Similar to what you can do in "Flashpoint Campaigns Red Storm".

 

Sorry if this has already been brought up!

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3 hours ago, ChrisWerb said:

One thing I really love about this forum is that an observation/request about SB can lead to a discussion where I learn lots of stuff that is completely new to me, despite spending 20+ years on the best armour discussion forum on the web.

 

Arguably it requires some direct experience (if simulated) to trigger specific questions (that's a feature of a simulation/training application). The answers could probably have been had at the other sites as well, you probably just didn't think of asking them because, well, we usually don't tend to question our own assumptions (I'm just as guilty of that as everyone else). The reason is simple: Out assumptions fill in the blanks of our world model to create a coherent picture. We only rework our world model if there are discrepancies, and usually we discover them only through personal experience (or reading some nonsense and taking it seriously enough to follow-up with a discussion, just to discover eventually that it wasn't nonsense after all - just facts contrary to our expectations).

:)

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We all have experience of at least peripheral relevance to participating in SB without having actual combat experience on armoured vehicles or otherwise. I think it is fair to make assumptions based on this knowledge and what we can learn from books, videos, veterans etc., but we have to take it for what it is and be ready to be corrected by those with direct experience/first hand knowledge.

 

I spent a long time looking at Google Streetview imagery of Southern Karelia and reached the following conclusions/observations.

 

1. A lot of forest - the majority - regardless of tree species or age/diameter, is so dense that it would be practically impossible to drive any armoured vehicle any distance through it. However, you could reverse into some of the less mature growth in order to hide from ground level threats, although it would be hard to disguise the new "notch" in the treeline from above.

2. Birch is a bit of a special case. It is very common and differs in being deciduous - the distance you can see through stands of Birch differs dramatically seasonally (the Google vehicle/s visited Finland at various times of year). It also differs in that, when self propagating, and particularly when compared to commercial early growth conifer plantations, it can be very open. Although there are stands of old birch that grow to very substantial diameters, these are comparatively rare - as I understand it some are protected national monuments.

3. In game, you can mount a flank ambush on a column of enemy vehicles and be able to see their roadwheels, minerollers etc. from a distance. Whereas, due to their closer proximity to the trees and geometry, they cannot see you at all. That gives you a huge advantage, particularly if you have opted for a 100% KE loadout (to avoid prematures on foliage with HEAT etc.). In reality, whilst there are locations that allow it (particularly when trees are planted to screen motorways etc.) this would often be impossible due to the sheer density of the forest trees and secondary growth.

4. SB models the difficulty of finding a position to shoot Spike in non update mode very well. Generally, unless there is open farmland or a lake between you and the target, the shot offered is straight down a road. I understand from a recently retired FDF SF Major friend that the short range of shots was a driver in selecting the 30mm for the CV9030F over larger calibre options.

 

 

 

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3 hours ago, ChrisWerb said:

One thing I really love about this forum is that an observation/request about SB can lead to a discussion where I learn lots of stuff that is completely new to me, despite spending 20+ years on the best armour discussion forum on the web. The amount of exertise here and people's willingness to share it (and that very much includes you GibsonM) makes it an awesome resource in its own right.

 

I agree. Helps when you accumulated have hundreds of years of expertize and knowledge across the members of this forum, in most if not all branches of the armed services. I know little about tanks, but was Light Infantry and recon for 15+ years.

And also that we mostly seem to be able to engage in civil discourse and dialogue.

 

And that many fortunately can manage to agree to disagree.

 

As I see it, then there are much too few licenses in private hands, for it to make sense that we get angry with each other.

Edited by Nike-Ajax

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4 minutes ago, Nike-Ajax said:

 

As I see it, then there are much too few licenses in private hands, for it to make sense that we get angry with each other.

 

Absolutely! I don't want to open a whole new(?) can of worms, but I think it helps to be tolerant and understanding of those you disagree with in almost any context, particularly as this forum gives a valuable impression about the sim and its community to many of those considering purchasing a licence.

Edited by ChrisWerb
Inadvertently referred to SB as a "game" :(

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I agree with your agreement ... :D

 

As a former bouncer, then I can surely say that there are times where dialogue ends, but am very hardpressed to see the context where this is neccesary here.

 

Sure we can disagree, and somebody migth annoy you. So fucking what:

Just dont engage in a conversation with them, choose another platoon or train with another group for awhile or just say what annoys via a PM you and talk it out like adults...

Edited by Nike-Ajax

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