Fuby Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 I been looking and getting a few of the skins.. wow, some great designs which really enhances the game! Thanks to all that put in hard work for this!! Then a light bulb went off (dim as it is) I want to know if I can block users from using custom skins? I been searching for the switch for this without luck.. can the use of "mod" skins be blocked within mission design? And for that matter within Multiplayer games? Reasoning: Although we all wish the world was perfect and no one would cheat (Im a strong anti-cheat player btw), what stops someone that does cheat from doing this to the enemy: I am so hoping that I just missed the switch to block this? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ssnake Posted February 22, 2012 Members Share Posted February 22, 2012 So far, social control and the honor principle seem to hold up. We already know a few possible countermeasures should some prick one day start to use these tricks to piss off everybody else. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuby Posted February 22, 2012 Author Share Posted February 22, 2012 So far, social control and the honor principle seem to hold up. We already know a few possible countermeasures should some prick one day start to use these tricks to piss off everybody else.AWWW man... now this is a BIG disappointment... I have such a mistrust of trusting.. (years of gameplay show different)This to "me" is a big error for the game and gameplay. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingtiger Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 well, we aren't your normal gaming community either. there has been some cheaters discovered during my many years around, and no-one of them was around for a long time after being discovered :men_ani:You could say that the fact that we are so few makes cheating harder then if you was playing BF3 or something. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Volcano Posted February 22, 2012 Moderators Share Posted February 22, 2012 (edited) AWWW man... now this is a BIG disappointment... I have such a mistrust of trusting.. (years of gameplay show different)This to "me" is a big error for the game and gameplay.First of all, no matter what you do, a cheater is going to cheat. There is no way to prevent that unless you disallow mods altogether and that is not something we want to do. I suppose you have some idea on how to prevent textures like those in your image, but those ideas really are not practical. If someone is willing to go out of their way to play an ugly simulation (because all their vehicles are pink) just so they can spot targets better in day sight, then, well, they are the ones that have to live with themselves. Secondly, who cares about those hot pink textures -- what is the point of making a hot pink vehicle when you already have thermal sights that cause vehicles to stand out even better than that?As in any game, the game itself is only as good as those you play with. You will have to learn to trust people, and then form your own opinion of specific people in the community as they abuse that trust. Play SB with those you trust, and steer clear of those you do not trust. For the most part the community is honorable, but on the odd occasion the "win at any costs" attitude does creep in and I get disappointed when I see it. If you suspect someone of cheating then don't play with that person or group of people.The difference here is that this is not the BF3 or ARMA community where everyone is anonymous because we have a relatively small and cozy community, like a neighborhood of friends. It seems that some people around here don't get it, but if someone does something like what you are worried about in SB and is caught (it is pretty easy to suspect), then it will be known throughout the community and their name will be soiled until they redeem themselves. Luckily also, unlike other games, gunnery ability is only so much of battle in SB; no matter what cheat someone may do, thankfully superior tactics will win the day.So really, if someone cheats in this community then it really is like that person shooting themselves in the foot since they will only ostracize themselves from the people that play SB, and therefore will end up with no one to play SB with. In ARMA or BF3 this does not apply because they can simply jump on to another server of new victims. Edited February 23, 2012 by Volcano clarification 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ssnake Posted February 22, 2012 Members Share Posted February 22, 2012 Well, there certainly are ways to make things harder for a cheater. Much harder. But it requires extra development time, and as long as this isn't really perceived as a serious problem, well, there always seems to be something else to do that is more urgent. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grenny Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 Add one thing:The AAR tool is quiete potent in that matter.So if one guy takes "too many insane" shots, it will get noticed. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuby Posted February 22, 2012 Author Share Posted February 22, 2012 what is the point of making a hot pink vehicle when you already have thermal sights that cause vehicles to stand out even better than that?. That's one good point.. probably the best point.. and ends my thoughts on this.. Add one thing:The AAR tool is quiete potent in that matter. So if one guy takes "too many insane" shots, it will get noticed. I dunno about that one... that darn AI has done some excellent shots on me already..lol.. I have a hard time calling a person a cheater because they can out shoot me..even if I cannot figure out how.. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Retro Posted February 22, 2012 Members Share Posted February 22, 2012 John CarmackThe problem is really only solvable by relying on the community to police itself, because it is a fundamentally unwinnable technical battle to make a completely cheat proof game of this type. Play with your friends.12345 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grenny Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 I dunno about that one... that darn AI has done some excellent shots on me already..lol...Japp, so far this works better the cheating...just let the AI do the gunning 8-) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Volcano Posted February 22, 2012 Moderators Share Posted February 22, 2012 I dunno about that one... that darn AI has done some excellent shots on me already..lol..I have a hard time calling a person a cheater because they can out shoot me..even if I cannot figure out how..Well, the AAR is a great tool to evaluate shots to start suspecting foul play, but as you imply, you should always give someone the benefit of the doubt. However, just keep in mind that it is pretty easy to hit targets in forests if all you see is a hot spot through the foliage. The real risk there is fratricide because you cannot properly ID the target, but other than that, it is certainly not very difficult to do. However, if you see humans firing through 2-3 km of forest then you have problems. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ssnake Posted February 22, 2012 Members Share Posted February 22, 2012 John Carmack probably forgot more about making games cheat proof than I will ever learn. Still, while he's probably right about the fundamental impossibility to prevent tampering, there certainly are a number of possible steps against casual "Joe Schmoe" level manipulations, and usually that is all that is needed to prevent a disruptive effect in multiplayer communities. Technical hurdles however can only be one aspect. The more important factor indeed is that the community polices itself in this respect. If you don't trust a certain player, don't play with him - plain and simple. Usually the problems will occur only if you turn the play into some sort of a competitive "league" play, or do it only for certain records. There are infinitely more ways to find enjoyment and satisfaction in solving a tactical challenge with a team of like-minded friends than competition ladders about 1337 headshot skillz. I got to admit though that this here is an . . 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brun Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 About 8 years ago a player that was considered a pillir of the Sb community (that I will not name) was suspected of Cheating. Study of aar's discovered to many 2-3 K shots in the woods. Also the player had an uncanny ability to find your units very quickly in large heavily wooded areas. His personal kills where also always off the charts. It Caused quite a rift in the community at the time. Those that where sure Cheating was going on, and those that called it a witch hunt. In the end He left and never returned. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabot_ready Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Sometimes I think somebody with a crappy internet connection has more of an impact on a game than pink skins. Sometimes its so bad that you would think they are using lag switches. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mogwa Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 I would say that skin mods such as pink or white skins are less of a problem than players that find an exploit and use it to make up for their, shall we say, tactical ineptitude. Ultimately, these jokers end up in the dust bin of SB history like some of the aforementioned alleged cheaters or are self exiled into their own little dark corner of the community.The answer is don't cheat or use exploits and avoid playing with those who do. i dont think people who are willing to pay over 100 bucks for a realistic armor sim are they same people who want to cheat just to win a scenario in most cases. Mog 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ssnake Posted February 23, 2012 Members Share Posted February 23, 2012 Sadly, the ability to spend $125.- on a computer game is not correlated with the willingness to resort to cheating in order to "win" a game, no matter what it might take. For some, the temptation will be irresistible, even if it is completely childish and pointless. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabot_ready Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 (edited) Sadly, the ability to spend $125.- on a computer game is not correlated with the willingness to resort to cheating in order to "win" a game, no matter what it might take. True....but the days of much of cheating came during the "game" version of SB. not so much of the " ProPE" timeframe.I will tell you...the whole game vs sim..is not as separate as people think thou. Edited February 23, 2012 by sabot_ready 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IrishHussar Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 With regards to people who cheat, for me this sim is about trying to prevail when all things ARE NOT equal. So allthough I would not entertain such people who think that it is okay to cheat, all is not lost.Irish 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuby Posted February 23, 2012 Author Share Posted February 23, 2012 However, just keep in mind that it is pretty easy to hit targets in forests if all you see is a hot spot through the foliage. The real risk there is fratricide because you cannot properly ID the target, but other than that, it is certainly not very difficult to do.Sheesh, I went away thinking your thermal argument was spot on.. but now you got me wondering again. I can see the possiblities still favoring the pink tanks..Okay, the community is so small (how dang small is it?) the chance of cheats is not an issue. Most big name games with all their protection still have aim bots etc anyways as mentioned, so the thoughts of blocking content that enhances the experience and immersion into this title would be counter productive I guess.Please keep in mind, "newb" alert to this title. And I seem to ramble and think more than I should. Just learning the ends and outs of the sim/game. Btw, still thinking it's the best darn tank game/sim I have had the experience of playing. It's very addictive to say the least.As sabot_ready already mentioned, lag, that has been in every title.. always an unpleasurable experience when you know the intent to cheat is not there, but the lag still helps the attacker out.Final note.. if and when you see me in MP games.. remember the "true" cheater would not of mentioned and showed this in the forums.. please don't reflect this as reverse psychology..lol My bottom line is why try to enjoy a game/sim for what it is if you have to cheat. always has been. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grenny Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Most big name games with all their protection still have aim bots etc anyways as mentioned, .....We have the aimbot build in allready(called AI-gunner)...so no need to script one :-D 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuby Posted February 23, 2012 Author Share Posted February 23, 2012 We have the aimbot build in allready(called AI-gunner)...so no need to script one :-D True dat... but we already have the switch built in for this one.. if your honest and respectable, looking for that challenge, you can always set your vehicle to "hold fire" and do it your self.. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grenny Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 True dat... but we already have the switch built in for this one.. if your honest and respectable, looking for that challenge, you can always set your vehicle to "hold fire" and do it your self.. Or the sce designer can set the vehicles on "blind" status, effectively taking the AI out of the equation 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuby Posted February 23, 2012 Author Share Posted February 23, 2012 Or the sce designer can set the vehicles on "blind" status, effectively taking the AI out of the equation I guess we are traveling off topic a bit.. but, if I designed a scenario as all blind.. wouldn't that make all Tanks/PC etc just ride around like total dummies? Might be a bit much but your right..another built in switch available.. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ssnake Posted February 23, 2012 Members Share Posted February 23, 2012 ...if I designed a scenario as all blind.. wouldn't that make all Tanks/PC etc just ride around like total dummies?Yes, it would. In a head-to-head game, this would be the equivalent to a shooting gallery experience where a single tank may actually shoot back. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscar19681 Posted March 9, 2012 Share Posted March 9, 2012 I would say that skin mods such as pink or white skins are less of a problem than players that find an exploit and use it to make up for their, shall we say, tactical ineptitude. Ultimately, these jokers end up in the dust bin of SB history like some of the aforementioned alleged cheaters or are self exiled into their own little dark corner of the community.The answer is don't cheat or use exploits and avoid playing with those who do. i dont think people who are willing to pay over 100 bucks for a realistic armor sim are they same people who want to cheat just to win a scenario in most cases. MogI think you have a very good point there. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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