Invader ZIM Posted August 7, 2012 Share Posted August 7, 2012 Hey guys, When I use the various vehicles like the Bradley, or M1, or the Leopard tanks, it doesn't seem to change how the thermal imagers look when detecting targets. Does anyone know if there's any plans in the future to have different quality thermal sights? Or if there's any mods that can change how the thermal sights look? For comparison, here's a photo of the M1A1's 1st gen thermal sight, photo below is from circa 1988 from a 3rd Armored division M1A1. Contrast that with the thermal image from an M-60A3 looking at another nearby M-60A3 taken in 1984 Now look at the thermal images provided by the Leopard 2 Below is a Leopard 2A4 thermal image. From the photos above and the Leopard 2A4 images Steel Beasts has this spot on!! Video of M1A2 SEP viewer: I was looking for some variation in this sim regarding the simulation of lower resolution 1st gen thermal vs. the higher resolution and sensitivity 2nd gen thermal viewers. Perhaps a gain and contrast control to allow the user to adjust the thermal sights to their preference? For instance I used to turn the gain down on my thermal and the contrast all the way up to immediately spot objects that were vastly different in themperature between the background, but my thermal sight wasn't cooled or more sensitive like a tank thermal though. Also always wondered about special paints as countermeasures on the tanks to reduce thermal visibility as demonstrated here: http://www.defensereview.com/intermat-anti-thermalir-camo-tech-for-infantry-and-special-operations-forces/ Or if in the future SB Pro can implement some active IR countermeasures systems and such for defence against ATGM? Sorry for the questions, ground warfare is pretty complex when you get into it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ssnake Posted August 7, 2012 Members Share Posted August 7, 2012 Well, when you compare Bradley, Leo 2, and Abrams, of course you'll notice no difference. They all have the same first generation thermal imager.Check out some of the other vehicles and eventually you'll notice more or less subtle differences. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invader ZIM Posted August 8, 2012 Author Share Posted August 8, 2012 Hi Ssnake, Thanks for the tip, I tried all of the CV90's, Pizarro, NZLAV-IMV, Challenger2, ASLAV-25, Centarro and noticed some differences in magnification and reticles, but the resolution of the image when zoomed out seems the same to me as the 1st gen sights from the other vehicles. I guess I was expecting the GPS thermal image at 1x with a newer thermal sight to have a better identification range, more resolution and less pixelation than the 1st gen thermal in this sim, unless I'm missing something. There's a big difference with the image intensified sight of the T-72 though, pretty good job, like the scintillation in the image! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[]_--__[]KITT Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 When I see a Leopard 2A6 thermal sight in youtube it had a very good resolution.I'm not aware if any thermal sight in Steel Beasts has such a fine resolution. Or those in SB are only 1st gen ones? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Volcano Posted August 8, 2012 Moderators Share Posted August 8, 2012 _--__[]KITT;217748']When I see a Leopard 2A6 thermal sight in youtube it had a very good resolution.I'm not aware if any thermal sight in Steel Beasts has such a fine resolution. Or those in SB are only 1st gen ones?Just look at the TIM on the Leo 2A5 DK in SB. And yes, for the most part all the gunner TIS on the tanks in SB are 1st generation. The exception to this is the M60A3 (TTS) which was known to have a very high resolution thermal sight (2nd gen?), and eventually this was dropped from the M1A0/M1A1 tanks because it was thought to be too expensive. If we ever have a playable M60A3, then the higher res TTS would be a nice strength (about the only strength). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Volcano Posted August 8, 2012 Moderators Share Posted August 8, 2012 For comparison, here's a photo of the M1A1's 1st gen thermal sight, photo below is from circa 1988 from a 3rd Armored division M1A1.Actually, those images you show appear to imply that there are huge differences in quality of TIS in the ones you mention. Actually this is false, the difference in the images is that someone turned up the sensitivity and contrast to the point that the image starts to bloom. Currently in SB we don't model that just yet, it is as if someone has perfectly focused and adjusted this. I don't particularly like that approach myself, I think the user should have to adjust the focus and sensitively of the image because this plays a huge part in real life depending on depth and how hot something is. Hopefully this will be supported one day in SB. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[]_--__[]KITT Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 Just look at the TIM on the Leo 2A5 DK in SB. And yes, for the most part all the gunner TIS on the tanks in SB are 1st generation. The exception to this is the M60A3 (TTS) which was known to have a very high resolution thermal sight (2nd gen?), and eventually this was dropped from the M1A0/M1A1 tanks because it was thought to be too expensive. If we ever have a playable M60A3, then the higher res TTS would be a nice strength (about the only strength).It would be great say that the thermal sight in Leopard 2A5 or above could be changed to that of the 2nd gen counterpart to reflect what is actually fielded(assuming all Leopard 2A5 and later received 2nd gen thermal sight) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Volcano Posted August 8, 2012 Moderators Share Posted August 8, 2012 _--__[]KITT;217752']It would be great say that the thermal sight in Leopard 2A5 or above could be changed to that of the 2nd gen counterpart to reflect what is actually fielded(assuming all Leopard 2A5 and later received 2nd gen thermal sight)If it isn't like that in SB, then it had the same 1st generation TIS as the 2A4. Unless you have information to the contrary of course. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ssnake Posted August 8, 2012 Members Share Posted August 8, 2012 Every thermal imager that we model in SB Pro is defined with a sensor resolution, which is the resolution that you'll get on the computer screen. The graphics card will then upscale the image to what you chose as the screen resolution. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damian90 Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 _--__[]KITT;217752']It would be great say that the thermal sight in Leopard 2A5 or above could be changed to that of the 2nd gen counterpart to reflect what is actually fielded(assuming all Leopard 2A5 and later received 2nd gen thermal sight)AFAIK all Leopard 2 variants besides newest A7 variant, have the same 1st generation thermal in gunner main sight. In A5 and A6 only TC thermal was more modern. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[]_--__[]KITT Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 AFAIK all Leopard 2 variants besides newest A7 variant, have the same 1st generation thermal in gunner main sight. In A5 and A6 only TC thermal was more modern.AH I see thanks I guess back to seeing green LEGO tanks :debile2: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invader ZIM Posted August 8, 2012 Author Share Posted August 8, 2012 LOL, good analogy, Lego tanks!! At 3km you really are shooting at heat blobs with these 1st gen thermal sights.Thanks for the information guys, learned something new as I didn't realise the M60A3 had a better thermal sight.And I agree with Volcano, it would be a nice feature to set up the sights for focus and for thermal to adjust gain and contrast if the sights have that option in the real vehicle. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
[]_--__[]KITT Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 Hehe I don't mind [seeing those LEGO tanks] as long as the real tankers on those tanks actually see the same green LEGO tanks...I'm a realism freak. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invader ZIM Posted August 8, 2012 Author Share Posted August 8, 2012 Me too, if that's what it looks like, then that's what it should look like in the sim. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hedgehog Posted August 8, 2012 Share Posted August 8, 2012 Actually, those images you show appear to imply that there are huge differences in quality of TIS in the ones you mention. Actually this is false, the difference in the images is that someone turned up the sensitivity and contrast to the point that the image starts to bloom. Currently in SB we don't model that just yet, it is as if someone has perfectly focused and adjusted this. I don't particularly like that approach myself, I think the user should have to adjust the focus and sensitively of the image because this plays a huge part in real life depending on depth and how hot something is. Hopefully this will be supported one day in SB.Well you could try this.http://www.steelbeasts.com/sbforums/showthread.php?t=11939&highlight=BloomOkay its not in game adjustable.... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Invader ZIM Posted August 9, 2012 Author Share Posted August 9, 2012 Thanks for that Hedgehog.I wasn't able to get the bloom mod to work with my installation of Steel Beasts Pro though. I like the idea of using a bloom mod, because in some situations like with the way it seems to do fog, and makes it harder to find enemies in tree lines when the sun's in your eyes.This sort of forces you to rely on your thermal sights for situational awareness. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azure Lion Posted August 9, 2012 Share Posted August 9, 2012 Alas, I'm getting 403/404 errors when I try to download any of the files. Either the site is gone, or I'm being blocked from accessing the site. Looks like a great mod though, love bloom effects. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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