Tjay Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 Can anyone tell me how far a rifle squad soldier can see if the mission setting is unlimited visibility? About 1500m is my guess. Of course, if visibility is reduced in the mission that may become the limiting factor. I'm tempted to also ask about how far he can see in woods, but I expect that is determined by a host of variables. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tacbat Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 Just a guess here, but if you open up the mission editor, select the flat map, then select the LOS tool, it should show you the range you can see with and without thermals. You can then adjust the vis to your liking to experiment. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tjay Posted September 3, 2013 Author Share Posted September 3, 2013 Thanks Tacbat. I has always thought that the LOS map showed the theoretical line of sight without restriction due to visibility or eyesight. I'd better go and RTFM. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tacbat Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I'm pretty sure that the LOS "bubble" will shrink with reduced vis, but it's been awhile since I played with it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mogwa Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 If I remember the formula correctly, the square root of 1.5 times the view point height in feet is the distance to the visible horizon in miles, if there are no undulations or obstructions (ie. the flat map). So if thats the case, assuming the soldiers eyes are around 6 feet in the air then the horizon is around 3 miles away. Your mileage may vary... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tjay Posted September 5, 2013 Author Share Posted September 5, 2013 Thanks Mogwa. More to this LOS stuff than I originally thought. So a new question emerges: when you click on 'Show LOS', what height of eye does the software use to calculate it? Actually, this is all a bit academic; my original question was generated as a result of using soldiers as recce units in a recent UKA scenario. It appeared they could spot things at 4km. There weren't any other units nearby that could have generated the map icon. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ssnake Posted September 5, 2013 Members Share Posted September 5, 2013 If I remember the formula correctly, the square root of 1.5 times the view point height in feet is the distance to the visible horizon in miles, if there are no undulations or obstructions (ie. the flat map). So if thats the case, assuming the soldiers eyes are around 6 feet in the air then the horizon is around 3 miles away. Your mileage may vary...That would apply to the real world (=a roughly spherical planetary surface). Steel Beasts has a flat earth model, so a conventional "horizon formula" does not apply.The LOS bubble in SB Pro is simplified to the extent that bushes and trees and buildings are rated as absolute LOS stoppers even if they were somewhat transparent; likewise, obstruction from ground clutter will not be taken into account (which however becomes quite relevant, the closer you are to the bottom).With 3.0 you'll have a slider to adjust the height above ground. This should allow you to LOS analyze the terrain from as low as one meter above ground. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tacbat Posted September 5, 2013 Share Posted September 5, 2013 With 3.0 you'll have a slider to adjust the height above ground. This should allow you to LOS analyze the terrain from as low as one meter above ground. I believe we have this with the current version of SB. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ssnake Posted September 5, 2013 Members Share Posted September 5, 2013 Yeah, but there was some additional change. Maybe it's that if you adjust the slider, it will also adjust the 3D preview to that height or something. Sue me, I haven't looked at 2.654 since about 18 months or so. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mpow66m Posted September 5, 2013 Share Posted September 5, 2013 how about yourself and the gang play an online match once 3.0 is released. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tjay Posted September 5, 2013 Author Share Posted September 5, 2013 That would apply to the real world (=a roughly spherical planetary surface). Steel Beasts has a flat earth model, so a conventional "horizon formula" does not apply.The LOS bubble in SB Pro is simplified to the extent that bushes and trees and buildings are rated as absolute LOS stoppers even if they were somewhat transparent; likewise, obstruction from ground clutter will not be taken into account (which however becomes quite relevant, the closer you are to the bottom).With 3.0 you'll have a slider to adjust the height above ground. This should allow you to LOS analyze the terrain from as low as one meter above ground.Understood. So am I right in thinking that if an uninterrupted line exists between two points, an infantry soldier at either of the points can see the other point regardless of distance, even tho in RL he would be restricted by his human eyesight? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tacbat Posted September 5, 2013 Share Posted September 5, 2013 Yeah, but there was some additional change.Ah, OK. With all the new features and 100's of bug fixes it's hard to keep track of everything. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rotareneg Posted September 5, 2013 Share Posted September 5, 2013 There's no height slider once a scenario has started with 2.654, so perhaps that's where it's been added. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ssnake Posted September 6, 2013 Members Share Posted September 6, 2013 Understood. So am I right in thinking that if an uninterrupted line exists between two points, an infantry soldier at either of the points can see the other point regardless of distance, even tho in RL he would be restricted by his human eyesight?Steel Beasts has been designed with the simplifying concept that spotting equals identification. We then reduced the likelihoods of detection, but in principle if you have 18km visibility limit and a lone soldier on top of a volcano shaped mountain he could detect other soldiers in a concealed position at that range ... given enough time. Of course the likelihood of detection in such a scenario is so close to zero that for all practical matters the unit will remain undetected.We may not keep this simplification forever, of course. I'm just explaining what the situation currently is. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ssnake Posted September 6, 2013 Members Share Posted September 6, 2013 There's no height slider once a scenario has started with 2.654, so perhaps that's where it's been added.No. There was this discrepancy that you could adjust your height in the 3D world but it would not reflect in the LOS height slider. Now, if you adjust the height slider it will also adjust the camera position in the 3D world when you go back to the preview. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Volcano Posted September 7, 2013 Moderators Share Posted September 7, 2013 If I remember the formula correctly, the square root of 1.5 times the view point height in feet is the distance to the visible horizon in miles, if there are no undulations or obstructions (ie. the flat map). So if thats the case, assuming the soldiers eyes are around 6 feet in the air then the horizon is around 3 miles away. Your mileage may vary... Jean is shorter than Brutus but taller than Imhotep. Imhotep is taller than Jean, but shorter than Lord Scotland. Lord Scotland is twice the height of Jean and Brutus combined but only one-tenth of the height of Millsy. Millsy is at a constant height of . If Jean stands exactly one nautical mile away from Lord Scotland, how tall is Imhotep? :-? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Members Ssnake Posted September 7, 2013 Members Share Posted September 7, 2013 Compiler error: Initialization does not compute. Jean > Imhotep && Imhotep > Jean. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tjay Posted September 7, 2013 Author Share Posted September 7, 2013 If Jean stands exactly one nautical mile away from Lord Scotland, how tall is Imhotep?:-? The same height as he has always been? Well, not always exactly, because he was shorter when he was much younger. But you get my drift - I hope. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Volcano Posted September 7, 2013 Moderators Share Posted September 7, 2013 The answer (according to the source): Imhotep is invisible. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tjay Posted September 9, 2013 Author Share Posted September 9, 2013 Doh. (Ancient Egyptian expression of distress). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tjay Posted September 9, 2013 Author Share Posted September 9, 2013 On second thoughts.... The statement 'Imothep is invisible' means that Imothep physically exists, even though he can't be seen. So he must have a certain height. So my original reply stands. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoggydog Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 flawed logic TJay, something's existence doesn't necessitate it being a physical entity. eg = emotions, wind, thought, Imothep 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lt DeFault Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 This is the deepest conversation about eyesight I've ever heard. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tjay Posted September 9, 2013 Author Share Posted September 9, 2013 flawed logic TJay, something's existence doesn't necessitate it being a physical entity.eg = emotions, wind, thought, Imothep But the name Imothep means he must be a PERSON, not an immaterial force, concept or emotion. IIRC, persons ARE physical entities. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoggydog Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 it could be a computer program, they have all sorts of weird namesor a virusor a hurricane for that matter 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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