Compass?

[outontheop]

Ok, so I haven't played in quite a while, and just started back up... I was curious if there were a compass to get better bearings than you can pull from the little turret/body/eye direction indicator. ...yes, I know that in reality, the metallic content of the tank would disturb the reading. In reality, I could also just jump off the tank for a minute.

*edit* aaaand, I'm not entirely certain why this posted in the scenarios sub-forum. Mods, please move?

[Tacbat]

The FO vehicles have compass readouts in them.

[Grenny]

Ok, so I haven't played in quite a while, and just started back up... I was curious if there were a compass to get better bearings than you can pull from the little turret/body/eye direction indicator. ...yes, I know that in reality, the metallic content of the tank would disturb the reading. In reality, I could also just jump off the tank for a minute.

*edit* aaaand, I'm not entirely certain why this posted in the scenarios sub-forum. Mods, please move?

...you do jump from the tank IOT to a ground recce (can I drive there without sinking in) or to have a stealthy look at the ENY. But only in extremely rare cases.

I've yet to find ONE tanky-guy to jump out of his turret to get the direction.

It's much easier to just READ THE F+++ING MAP :-P

[Grenny]

The FO vehicles have compass readouts in them.

...as they have a gyro-stabilized-GPS-coupled-theodolit-compass...accurate to +/- 0,1 mil if its a good setup.

These thingies are mighty cool

[outontheop]

*lol* Yes, I know all about the BFIST, FISTV, and FS3 sensors. I was a fire support officer for almost 6 years.

And I want the compass more for defensive scenarios wherein there is no FISTV present. In that case, an halfway competent tanker would, as part of his preparations, prepare a range card with the azimuth to prominent reference points. That way, you can call fire based off the displacement (viewed through the binocular graticule), without even needing a compass.

As it stands, to do this, I would need to edit the scenario to place a FISTV directly on top of my tank's position, use it to find azimuths, record the azimuths, make a range card (which generally is pretty hard in SB, as there are a lot less distinctive short range reference points, and the draw distance isn't long enough for distant reference points like radio towers, power line pylons, etc), exit the scenario, delete the FISTV, then run the scenario. I'd just rather avoid the hassle if possible.

[Grenny]

Hmm, I never used range cards with compass bearings as reference.

Allways used the bearing markers of the turret ring so you have the direction in reference to the hull position.

Much easier or the gunner/driver to process that instead of compass readings.

As plt-cdr also never used compass bearings in defence, but gave tgts in reference to terrain features.(which had to be on every vehicles range card)

But I recon there are different ways to go.

As a starter we don't call it range-card but "Geländespinne" ;-)

[Kingtiger]

I was a fire support officer for almost 6 years.

Hmm, I never used range cards with compass bearings as reference.

Allways used the bearing markers of the turret ring so you have the direction in reference to the hull position.

Much easier or the gunner/driver to process that instead of compass readings.

As plt-cdr also never used compass bearings in defence, but gave tgts in reference to terrain features.(which had to be on every vehicles range card)

But I recon there are different ways to go.

As a starter we don't call it range-card but "Geländespinne" ;-)

I see the difference there. two different backgrounds with two different focuses. I have neither used compass headings for rangecards, but I can see a FO think different as he uses different tools to work his magic compared to a plt/vehicle commander.

With that said, a compass would be sweet (I play allot more with infantry nowadays so the "Compass in tank doesn't work" reason is outdated) but I guess its far down the list.

/KT

[Tacbat]

With that said, a compass would be sweet (I play allot more with infantry nowadays so the "Compass in tank doesn't work" reason is outdated) but I guess its far down the list.

You could attach an FO team to your troops.

[Apocalypse 31]

I have neither used compass headings for rangecards

KT

Bad Ranger. You speak blasphemy.

[12Alfa]

We have the red tank compass bottom left. If you can't take a bearing from that to call a fire mission, well..., no I won't go there:c::c:.

A precise bearing is not required:cool2:, as you most likely need to adjust anyway:luxhello:, if no adjustment is need, fire for effect, know your impact foot print per ammo type.

But you know this already being a arty person, right?:confused:

"prepare a range card with the azimuth to prominent reference points"

We use the tanks azimuth ref to a prominent trg on the ground (night/day) no compass is required, range card has azimuth of tank/turret relationship.

Edited October 31, 2013 by 12Alfa
Gettin old, cut me some slack

[Grenny]

We use the tanks azimuth ref to a prominent trg on the ground (night/day) no compass is required, range card has azimuth of tank/turret relationship.

Yep...that's like we do it :-)

So that was not a different national procedures issue...but a beret-color issue ;-)

[Froggy]

Or a tank issue...

We used the tank Hull/turret azimuth clock with AMX30, but precise position and range with Leclerc (there is almost the same system than in lemur with memorized points)

[Kingtiger]

Bad Ranger. You speak blasphemy.

Good thing I'm not a Ranger tabbed person then :luxhello:

[Kingtiger]

You could attach an FO team to your troops.

tell that to all mission designers, that I if KT gonna play TGIF every squad need a FO team attached. :clin:

[Apocalypse 31]

Good thing I'm not a Ranger tabbed person then :luxhello:

I had a Sweede in my class. A 1LT, good guy.

[Grenny]

Good thing I'm not a Ranger tabbed person then :luxhello:

yapp, mech inf doesn't linger around long enough to measure all bearings with a compass...but if you're movin as slow as light inf ;-)

[Kingtiger]

I had a Sweede in my class. A 1LT, good guy.

At Ranger School? how did he fare? did he graduate?

[Kingtiger]

yapp, mech inf doesn't linger around long enough to measure all bearings with a compass...but if you're movin as slow as light inf ;-)

Well I was APC gunner in the mech infantry when I was taught the skills so yeah, we dont have time for bearings. But now I belong to Combat Engineer unit (Practically infantry you know - lol) so now I would have time to take bearing and measure with a 1m stick the distance to every TRP. Thats how fast we move now...

[Tacbat]

We have the red tank compass bottom left.

I guess one could print out a compass overlay with the mils on a transparancy, then tape it over the red tank compass to get a bearing off of.

[Tacbat]

tell that to all mission designers, that I if KT gonna play TGIF every squad need a FO team attached. :clin:

OK, every new TGIF mission I make will have that just for you.

[outontheop]

I think people are getting confused over the difference between reference points used to talk your gunner onto a target, and reference points used to talk artillery (or another tank's gunner) onto a target. The only people that know your hull/turret frame of reference are the folks in your tank. You can't call artillery (or air) off of it. They need a map reference.

I would just like a compass so I can call artillery using neither the cheat-tastic "click on map" method, nor the "eh, that's probably good give-or-take 200 mils" red tank compass methods. I want first round effects. I can do that with an M2 artillery compass or lensatic compass (each accurate to within about 20 mils). I can't with the red tank compass.

[outontheop]

W

A precise bearing is not required:cool2:, as you most likely need to adjust anyway:luxhello:, if no adjustment is need, fire for effect, know your impact foot print per ammo type.

But you know this already being a arty person, right?:confused:

Sarcasm unnecessary.

Also, artillery fail. In practice, I almost NEVER needed an adjusting round; even with a compass and a set of M22 binos, I generally could achieve first-round effects on target. Which is good, because statistically speaking, you inflict about half as many casualties for each adjusting round you require. Why give the bad guys time to find cover? Better to just drop the first sheaf right on their heads. But to do that, you need a good compass.

[Gibsonm]

I would just like a compass so I can call artillery using neither the cheat-tastic "click on map" method, nor the "eh, that's probably good give-or-take 200 mils" red tank compass methods. I want first round effects. I can do that with an M2 artillery compass or lensatic compass (each accurate to within about 20 mils). I can't with the red tank compass.

Well be an FO then (either, dismounted, mounted in a FO vehicle or operating a UAV).

If you want to call artillery like an FO, why do it as a crew commander?

[Grenny]

Sarcasm unnecessary.

Also, artillery fail. In practice, I almost NEVER needed an adjusting round; even with a compass and a set of M22 binos, I generally could achieve first-round effects on target. Which is good, because statistically speaking, you inflict about half as many casualties for each adjusting round you require. Why give the bad guys time to find cover? Better to just drop the first sheaf right on their heads. But to do that, you need a good compass.

In that case, I'd like to recruit you as an FO for our next multi-player missions.

Hedge...you're out ;-)

[Grenny]

Or a tank issue...

We used the tank Hull/turret azimuth clock with AMX30, but precise position and range with Leclerc (there is almost the same system than in lemur with memorized points)

Well, there is something like that in the Marder too.

We have mechanical markers that you can move on the turret ring :-)

So you tell to gunner: S3 (=marker #3) elevation 10 mil, fire. No need for fancy electronics :-P