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10 hours ago, Ssnake said:

Well, 140mm was in the 1980s determined by the Bundeswehr as the maximum caliber that a human loader could still manage as a single cartridge ... with "still acceptable" loading times. There's always the option to separate projectile from propellant to cut down weight. Or to have power-assisted loading.


So, it's probably not the simplistic question: "Autoloader - yay or nay?"

but rather: "Would you like a human loader, requiring a larger internal volume with the associated resuction in overall protection level and increase in vehicle mass plus power tools to help him handle the ammunition ... or an autoloader that is equally fast (or better) with larger calibers, but no additional capability in near-field security and surveillance, and no support in your maintenance tasks, which will require a reorganization of how we're doing things?"


Or, dare I suggest it, that with advancements in armor technology, and if the "loader" does not actually need the room to move around and load the gun, might it be possible to have a fourth crewman who serves merely as an assistant/observer?

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What the heck happened to this T-72???


It looks to me like it either fired the first grenade out of the gun, or possibly the grenade lit off the powder charges and thus fired the main gun?  And the second one went off down in the turret?



Either that or yelling things at it over and over again made it just get tired of hearing it and commit suicide.

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On 4.9.2016 at 2:47 PM, Kingtiger said:

Yeah people think that just because a vehicle is amphibious it can just drive into the water, swim and come up again on the other side. Reality is a bit harder then that.


If it was like this, the engineers would be jobless :-P


I do love the engineer workboats! 2 Pumpjets with 400 HP...small powermonsters :-D,


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OK, now it's more like, well over 150 attempts to get various vehicles to cross various rivers on various maps have resulted in two successful crossings.


I don't consider amphibious operations a feature of ProPE at this point.  It simply does not work.  Period.  End of story.

Edited by Maj.Hans
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On ‎06‎/‎09‎/‎2016 at 0:13 AM, Furia said:

Nice exercise!!!

Thanks for posting Furia

 Enjoyed seeing the PT-91 in action I have heard its the best and most comprehensive upgrade of all the T-72 variants

I wonder how the Nato tankers would rate it.

Its hard to get an un biased view though of soviet/Russian equipment from western soldiers.


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IMO the best way to compare vehicles is to simulate them and then to compare for oneself. For example I don't think that the T-72's fire control system is terrible, and the gunner's and commander's place aren't terrible in their ergonomics either (particularly when considering that the Soviets only drafted short people into the tank force because of the vast numbers of recruits every year from which to choose).


Where things are substantially different are post-penetration survivability - something that quickly shows on the battlefield, but something that the average soldier may not have an informed opinion. Also a big difference is maintenance and life cycle costs. This is something where soldiers are probably best when giving their opinion, but ONLY if they have received training on both system (and collected some experience). So the best people to judge how the PT-91 holds up to other tanks would be Polish tank soldiers who have received training on both systems. Plus, ask the maintenance guys for turnaround times when it comes to bigger repairs - changing a gun barrel, an engine, replacing tracks, etc. These are all factors that rarely show up on spec sheets, and they are usually glossed over in shallow comparisons. Like, "the best 10 tanks of all times" and similar nonsense.

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EXCELLENT montage & recordings of Challenger IIs operating in Iraq during the war. Seems to an older footage, but haven't seen it so far. You even have the infamous CR2 @ 7:00 which was immobilized & shot up near Basra.



Edited by daskal
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