School me a bit on the new Leopard 1's

[Maj.Hans]

I'm a little confused by the history of some of these, as they seem to have been upgraded and reused over and over and over again. I just want to make sure I understand all of this as I'm a little unclear on how some of them fit in with the other vehicles we have...

The new Leopard 1A5 is an upgrade of the old 1A1s, and is essentially the same as the old 1A5DK that we've always had, but it's based on the older cast turret rather than the welded turret.

The 1A5 is from the mid-late 1980s, and the 1A5DK seems to be newer (?) although in terms of capabilities it's about the same?

the Leopard AS1 can also be used to represent a 1A3 or a 1A4, although I don't know if either of those came with the LRF found on the AS1? (BTW, will we ever see an IR night vision mode for the AS1? Maybe something similar to the NVGs?)

The Leopard 1V I have no clue about...

Wikipedia (I know, I know) claims that it is equivalent to the 1A5, but the 3D model and pictures I see of the 1V makes it look like little more than a cast turret Leo 1 with the add on armor of the 1A5 program? So what is it really, and what decade does it belong in?

[Gibsonm]

the Leopard AS1 can also be used to represent a 1A3 or a 1A4, although I don't know if either of those came with the LRF found on the AS1? (BTW, will we ever see an IR night vision mode for the AS1? Maybe something similar to the NVGs?).

AS1 never had TI or even II (mid life refit promise that never happened).

Best nightfighting option was the mantlet mounted searchlight that could do white light or IR (neither of which are modelled I think).

NVG only very recently (i.e. a year or two before they were retired).

From say 1975 - 2005 I'd say no NVG at all and from 2005 - 2008 driver only.

[dejawolf]

this timeline should answer some of your questions:

http://www.steelbeasts.com/sbwiki/index.php/Vehicle_timeline

for the other stuff, the german leopard 1A4 according to shackleton had the EMES-12A3 FCS, a computerized coincidence rangefinder.

wikipedia is wrong about the leopard 1V, chile bought their leopards from the dutch in 1998,

which has the coincidence rangefinder from the 1A4.

the 1V was modified to fit a thermal, (it's that circular thing on the loaders side) but the funding never came.

[Maj.Hans]

So the 1V is, essentially, a 1A5 type upgrade without thermal sights?

Going back to the AS1, even though the AS1 itself never received any kind of night sights, perhaps adding an image intensifier mode to it as an optional feature (kinda like how we can add an RWS to vehicles) might be useful for when it's being used as a 1A3/1A4 stand in? I understand those vehicles did get some night vision added on when the Leopard 2's went over to thermal sights.

[Gibsonm]

I guess eSim would need to fund that AS1 "mod".

I think (could well be wrong) the AS1 is in there because we paid for it.

I almost certain we would fund any "options" for it since we no longer use it and when we did use it, it didn't them.

[Tacbat]

this timeline should answer some of your questions.

Nice reference.

[Eisenschwein]

You want to know somethink about Leop 1 ??

I'm a little confused by the history of some of these, as they seem to have been upgraded and reused over and over and over again. I just want to make sure I understand all of this as I'm a little unclear on how some of them fit in with the other vehicles we have...

The new Leopard 1A5 is an upgrade of the old 1A1s, and is essentially the same as the old 1A5DK that we've always had, but it's based on the older cast turret rather than the welded turret.

Hardly yes,

The 1A5 is from the mid-late 1980s, and the 1A5DK seems to be newer (?) although in terms of capabilities it's about the same?

First Leop 1A5A1 was fielded at Panzerbataillon 14 Hildesheim in Mid 1987. The Upgrade to Leop 1A5 was planed as a 2 Step upgrade (like the Leop 2A5 Upgrade Years later). First Step was to build in a new Rangefinder and FCS (EMES 18), Direct Sight for the TC aso...

Second Step should be to implement the 120mm L44 Gun and additional armor to the Front.

After some testing in Meppen and the Reunion of Germany they left Step Two in the Paperbasket.

The Danes come later with the Upgrade, because their Leop 1A3 DK has allready a FCS (comparable to the FCS of M48/60).

the Leopard AS1 can also be used to represent a 1A3 or a 1A4, although I don't know if either of those came with the LRF found on the AS1? (BTW, will we ever see an IR night vision mode for the AS1? Maybe something similar to the NVGs?)

The Leop 1A3/A4 has nor LRF but a FCS and 2 s.c. BIV´s (Bildverstärker Gerät). BIV´s are II build to use them instead of the Driver and Loader Periscopes, but can also be used by the TC. Aussies Leop 1A3 were retrofitted with a FCS by SABCA. Main differences Leop 1A1-A2 and A3-A4 is the FCS and the stable Rangefinder; A3 use the old TRP as TC Optic; A4 use a PERI R12 .

The Leopard 1V I have no clue about...

Wikipedia (I know, I know) claims that it is equivalent to the 1A5, but the 3D model and pictures I see of the 1V makes it look like little more than a cast turret Leo 1 with the add on armor of the 1A5 program? So what is it really, and what decade does it belong in?

The Dutch were one of the first Nation fielded Leopard 1 and as a Member of LEOBEN they get all upgrades Germany get (New Track, Sideskirts, NBC Protection a.s.o.)

One of the latest Upgrade was the PZB 200 (Passives Zielgerät). That is the empty Basket front left on the Mantlet of the Leo 1V in SB, the Camera of PZB 200 is missing. This is a II coming from Leopard 2 (they used it at the first Batches Leop 2 because the TIS is not working as it should). So the Dutch did like Germany do an fitted the PZB 200 to their Leop 1 in the early 1980`s.

Here is my personel Timeline to use with SB:

- Leop 1AS Since 1973 in Service (Leop 1A3/A4; Leop 1DK; Leop 1C1; Leop 1GR1; Leop 1T1)

- Leop 1V Represent Upgrade since 1980 (Leop 1A1A1; Leop 1NL; Leop 1IT; Leop 1BE)

- Leop 1A5 Since 1987 (Leop 1C2, Leop 1A5 BE)

- Leop 1A5 DK Since 1992

[Grenny]

Just for trivia:

The Leopard 1A5's FCS was significantly better then the Leopard2 systems of the time.

(Leo 2A2 and Leo 2A3)

...more accurate and much faster.

It was only due to Industry intervention (they wanted to sell their Leo 2's) that a Leo 2 and NOT the Leopard 1 was send to the CATT!

[Sander]

Even apart from the differences in tool boxes, aerials and rooftop AA MG a telltale difference of the NLD Leopard 1V compared to 1A5's is the fact that the original primary gunner sights were not faired over. The original optics were retained as development of planned new equipment suffered development problems and delays. The Leopard1V program aimed to bring vehicles up to a similar, but not identical standard as the German Leopard1A5. One of the main differences would have been the installation of night vision equipment from the national industry rather than of German origin. Due to development delays the intended equipment was long delayed and never entered service, resulting in night blind vehicles as during refurbishment of the turret searchlights and any active IR had already been removed in expectation of the new kit.

Combined with problems due to economy measures (the turrets were refurbished, but not the remainder of the vehicle, leading to problems with increased wear and tear due to the heavier weight of the new turrets) the lack of a night vision capability led some to comment that the V in the designation did not stand for Verbeterd (Improved), but for Verprutst (Screwed up). Eventually the continued problems led to a decision to drop the national development and implement changes that were closer to the German standard, including the installation of the foreign make of NV equipment. Only 2 vehicles were fully brought up to the full German Leopard1A5 standards, including a three tone camo finish instead of good old RAL6014, before the fall of the Berlin Wall occurred and all gun tanks of the Leopard1 family were taken out of service in the following defence cuts.

Source: Leopard1. De gepantserde vuist van de Koninklijke Landmacht (http://www.defensie.nl/nimh/publicaties/publicaties_nimh/de_leopard_1)

Regards,

Sander

Edited September 26, 2013 by Sander